William Davis Oral History Transcript
Media
Part of William Davis Oral History
content
William Davis
Marist College
Poughkeepsie, NY
Transcribed by Kyra Walker
For the Marist College Archives and Special Collections
William Davis
Transcript – William Davis
Interviewee:
William Davis
Interviewer:
Gus Nolan
Interview Date:
5 September
2018
Location:
Marist Archives and Special Collections
Topic:
Marist College History
See Also:
MHP – Oral History
http://library.marist.edu/archives/oral_history.html
Subject Headings:
Davis, William
Marist College—History
Marist College (Poughkeepsie, N.Y.)
Marist College—Social Aspects
Marist College-Teaching
Summary:
William Davis talks of his time before working at Marist College, his career at Marist College,
the notable students that he’s taught and what he’d like to see for the college’s future.
Gus Nolan (
00:00
):
Today is September 5th, and we have an opportunity to have an interview with Bill Davis who is a
former professor here at Marist College in New York, English/Communication area; been here for a
number of years, but he has an interesting background before, during and after his time at Marist. So
good morning Bill.
William Davis (
00:29
):
Good morning Gus.
GN (
00:31
):
Bill, this is divided into four or five areas: one before Marist, coming to Marist, time in Marist, after
Marist. So that's kind of where we're going. So let's talk a little before Marist, the early years. Where
were you born, brought up, grade school, high school. Can you say a few words to that? Do you
remember?
WD (
00:54
):
[Laughter] I remember it just like it was almost yesterday. William, Bill Davis. I was born and raised in
New York City. Harlem, to be exact, between 138th street, somewhere around 138th street. And I went
to St. Marks, an Evangelist Catholic school, for eight years. And then, when I graduated--got my diploma
from there--I got an opportunity to go to Cardinal Hayes up on 650 Grand Concourse in the Bronx.
GN (
01:32
):
I know it well.
WD (
01:32
):
You know it well. It's a four-year school of course, but the first year I had to go down to St. Bernard's on
13th Street, a 113th street. So I commuted down there and then I went to Cardinal Hayes, the main
campus. And I took the standard curriculum, didn't know really what I wanted to do but I was always
a...what I call a bookworm. I love reading. I was in the library all the time in Cardinal Hayes. So I did that.
Actually my time in high school was spent within the four years...the first two years I did all of what you
supposed to do, go to classes and all like that. And I did work a little bit on the side. I did not get into
sports much. I was not a good basketball player. I'm tall--6' 3'--but I enjoyed what I did. And let me think
what's also significant-
GN (
02:44
):
Could you say something about work? Did you work during the summers? Afterschool?
WD (
02:49
):
I worked doing...oh that's a good thing, that's going way back. I worked after school. There was all kinds
of opportunities for jobs, everywhere in New York City because Cardinal Hayes still has a unique feeling
among a lot of people.
GN (
03:09
):
Give me a time span. Are we talking about the fifties or sixties? What time span?
WD (
03:13
):
Okay. This was 19...oh now let me see...1950. I graduated from St. Marks the Evangelist and I went to
Cardinal Hayes. So 1950 to 1954. So the first year I was in St Bernard's down on 113th Street.
GN (
03:32
):
Okay. Alright. I just want to get a handle about the...what was going on in the country and so on.
WD (
03:39
):
So...let's see here...so the first two years, I had one unique honor. I was very surprised that I was elected
class president in 2-U. That's the way they numbered the classes, 2-ABC. So it had a lot of students from
all over the city. So I was very, very pleased at that. And I didn't really get into the key sports there. We
had class intramurals and I was involved in that. Let's see...not playing basketball, but high jumping and
stuff like that. So I enjoyed that. So that was my first two years. The second year--going into the third
year, we had to make a decision whether we were going to go the academic route, to proceed to go to
college--four-year college or not. Now I come from a very, very poor background. It was myself, my
mother and my sister. My father had died earlier. So there was really no funds available to pay to go to
college. So, I really didn't go for a while, but I was thinking all along. And then what happened was I
went to the...I'm trying to think of what did they call it, the counseling area. And-
GN (
05:20
):
This is in high school?
WD (
05:21
):
This is up in Cardinal Hayes. And I said, I'd like to go to college, I says, but I'm looking at a two-year
college--city college, which was not far from me. You had to have an 85 average to go. I had an 83, so I
didn't even bother going there, but I found this one little school called Westchester Community College,
which was at the time up in White Plains. So I got a booklet and looked through it and I said, 'hey, I like
to look into this.' So I did look into it. I went up there and I talked to them and everything. I took a test
and everything and I got to go to Westchester Community College. So I commuted from 138st and
Grand Concourse because New York Central had a train stop there. So I'd get on the train in the morning
and within, I don't know, 30-35 minutes, I was in White Plains. So I love getting out of the city, but one
little tale. Before I was able to go to Westchester Community College in White Plains, I had to go to the
other community college in New York City in Brooklyn, and tell them why I wanted to go up there and
not in New York. And I said to them, well, I says I wanted to get into the country and it was easier and
quicker for me to take the train from 138st to White Plains than to take the subway to Brooklyn. So it
was very, very nice. I took electrical by the way.
GN (
07:06
):
Oh, you did?
WD (
07:06
):
Yes. Electrical, technology. I don't have a background in that, but I was just fascinated by it. So I did that
for two years. I got my associate's degree, and I did have a work assignment at Con Edison in Staten
Island--not Staten Island, I'm trying to think of where it was. One of the suburbs of New York.
GN (
07:31
):
City Island?
WD (
07:31
):
City Island, something like that--during the summer. So they had internships for all of the students
during the summer. So I was able to do that during the summer. Made a little bit of money.
GN (
07:45
):
What kind of work was it?
WD (
07:47
):
It was electrical work.
GN (
07:49
):
What kind of work? Switches? Wiring?
WD (
07:51
):
Nope, not wiring. They had these...I'm trying to think of the name they call it.
GN (
07:58
):
Just make up a name. We wouldn't know the difference.
WD (
08:00
):
Protectors. They had these circuit protectors for the poles and we had to sit at this little table--not a
table, but a seat and check out the wiring in it during the summer. So I did that, and thoroughly enjoyed
that. It was just fascinating. I was always fascinated by things electrical. So I did that for literally two
years and then I graduated, and I went looking for a job. Well, I looked at places. I interviewed with
General Electric in Syracuse, New York. So I interviewed, they offered me a job. So I says, 'my goodness,
I'm going to have to go to Syracuse.' So I went up there, but before I did that, in...let's see...at
Westchester Community College, I met my wife, Betty--Betty Hayes, and we became a couple. We
had...we got married, and then we went to Syracuse. So I worked at General Electric in a place called
Electronic Park, which was just north of Syracuse. So I was there for...I'm trying to think about it...three
years or something like that. And then I decided, 'hey, we really wanted to come back home to
Westchester. So something happened...in the meantime, my mother-in-law, her husband died and...so
she wondered if we would come back and live with her in Elmsford. So we decided to do that. So after
about three-four years at GE--which was a very, very good company and I thoroughly enjoyed it--we
came back and stayed with her for a couple of years. In the meantime--I told you I have a varied
background--other opportunities came up. I had about two or three different jobs, all electrical. And I
thoroughly enjoyed that. The one thing that really stands out for me, all the jobs I had, I worked at this
one firm which was in Tarrytown. It was called Simmons Precision. And what did they do? They made
fuel gauges for aircraft, and they and another company had the monopoly of this device for all of the
aircraft in the United States. And Simmons Precision had the main plant in Tarrytown, and they also had
a manufacturing facility up in Vergennes, Vermont.
GN (
11:27
):
That's way up north.
WD (
11:27
):
Right. So I commuted from Elmsford to Tarrytown, which wasn't too far. And then I was a technical
writer at the time, write technical manuals. So a couple of times I was able to go up to Vergennes,
Vermont using a company aircraft. So I'd go out to Westchester...I mean to the...what is it? The airport
in White Plains. I would get on the plane and the guy in the private plane would take me up to
Vergennes, Vermont. I would talk to some engineers about things regarding the technical manuals. And
so I produced several technical manuals regarding the fuel gauging on the aircraft that went on Apollo
11. Now I'm trying to think in my notes here. I have down here that Apollo 11 was the one that went to
the moon. So I did have a preliminary manual, but I'm sure that it was changed and all like that. But the
fact that I was able to get on the aircraft, go up to Vergennes, Vermont, talk to the engineer and come
back the same afternoon. It was absolutely wonderful.
GN (
12:58
):
Boy, this is very interesting Bill. I never saw this part of your life. I'm glad I have the opportunity to let
you tell it and to be recorded for Marist archives. So when they do a big research about the people who
came here and Marist and what it is...your past experiences are unique. Let me move quickly ahead
though because time is running on. What I have on my notes is something about...tell me about your
career at IBM. Longevity there and then you coming to Marist.
WD (
13:30
):
Okay. At IBM, I was a technical writer and I did that for a couple of years and then I got promoted to be
a manager of other technical writers. And then I got a promotion to be the technical communication
manager for the whole site of IBM, which was over 11,000 people.
GN (
13:57
):
Which IBM center is this?
WD (
13:59
):
In Fishkill, I worked in Fishkill. And so I had about five or six different, very experienced technical writers
who wrote and talked to engineers about different things that IBM was doing. And so I enjoyed that. I
was a manager for there for several years. And then let me see what happened-
GN (
14:28
):
Okay. Give me a...is this now in the eighties? When would you say this was?
WD (
14:32
):
This was...just hold tight here...this was in the sixties. In the sixties here. So I was in IBM from 1966 I
believe, to 1990. So I had a series of different positions-technical writer, publications manager. So yeah,
I did that.
GN (
14:59
):
Yeah. Very good. The other person I know at IBM when I was there was a guy called Jim Fahey who also-
WD (
15:07
):
Jim Fahey was the technical person there in the whole plant. And my boss at the time reported to him.
So I knew Jim.
GN (
15:26
):
I worked with him for a while and then eventually when I retired, he took my position here. So that was
kind of an exchange. Alright, tell me about your coming to Marist. How did that happen?
WD (
15:43
):
How did that happen? Well, tell you a little bit of history about IBM. From 1966 to 1986, it was straight-
line growth. It was just wonderful. We had a great job. We were making good salary and all like that. Life
was good. However, like everything else, other firms start coming along. Apple started coming along,
and IBM began to not to have a dominance in computers. Apples became the best ones around, so to
speak. So...let me think here now...so that was then, and I'm trying to think of the sequence here. I
think...what else? [Paper Rustling]
GN (
16:43
):
'86-90' your last-
WD (
16:47
):
Oh, yeah. '66 to '86. That's 1986...what IBM started doing was to start downsizing and closing some
plants. Word got around and I knew that things were going to change at IBM. They didn't tell us any
warning, but because I had worked at other companies, I knew how things worked because a lot of
people only work for IBM and they didn't have a sense of what it was like in the real world. So I knew
that things were changing. So I said, look, I need to do something. So they started downsizing the
technical writing area. The next thing I knew I was working for an engineering group as...what, I'm trying
to think of the title. I didn't really have...an aid more or less. So here I am with these highly technical
engineers and all I had was my experience--technical writing. To me, it wasn't enough. I needed to do
something else. So out of the blue--no one told me--I picked the phone one day and called Dennis
Murray. And I told Dennis that things are changing at IBM, and I'm looking for an opportunity to expand
my horizon. Well, that started the ball rolling. And then, oh my goodness, I had several interviews and all
like that and...I'm just trying to think of-
GN (
18:30
):
So that was an initiative you took? It was not responding to something you saw in the paper or
something?
WD (
18:36
):
Oh no. This is just strictly me, because like I said, I had worked at other firms and I knew how things
worked. So I says no...and anyway--to make a long story short, I was offered an opportunity and I came
to IBM. I was very, very pleased. I mean came to Marist. I'm very, very pleased with that.
GN (
18:56
):
Okay. And what did you do at Marist? What was the first thing you did?
WD (
19:01
):
Well, the first thing I did was...they set up a job for me...oh, working with Bob Norman; who was a key
person there, and he took me under his wing and we would go down to New York City to all of the-
GN (
19:22
):
This was the internship program?
WD (
19:24
):
Internship program. We went to all of the tv networks and all like that. He was telling me about different
people. And so we would go down there a lot. Like every couple of weeks we would take the train down
and go to ABC, CBS, NBC--all of them. And the radio stations too. But mostly it was the tv stations. So
met a lot of people and, he took me under his wing. And Bob Norman was just a unique person. He was
cool and quiet and very, very professional.
GN (
20:00
):
Oh yeah, I know him well. Okay. But, getting into actually teaching...you were doing public speaking? Or
writing? What did you do here at Marist?
WD (
20:14
):
Well I handled part-time the internship program along with Bob Norman. And then I started teaching.
And I'm trying to think of what my first job was...teaching public speaking. Because I did that a lot. So I
taught several classes in public speaking, and I would teach students how to get in front of an audience
to talk to people. And I found it absolutely terrifying for most students. The worst thing in the world
they wanted to do was stand in front of the-
GN (
20:59
):
Their own classmates.
WD (
21:01
):
Their classmates and talk. So one of the things that made it comfortable for me--because at IBM, I had
to talk to a lot of people in different areas and I was used to doing that, so...I taught that.
GN (
21:18
):
Yeah, okay. Turn the page now. Marist has changed considerably since you first came here with Bob
Norman. What strikes you most? Is it the buildings? Is it the student body? Is it the academic program?
What would you say is...physically there's been a lot of changes, but maybe that's not the first thing.
WD (
21:42
):
Okay, physically there's been a lot of change for me. For me, it's personal. One of the things that I didn't
tell you about, the...one of the dorms here that used to be the basketball court...Marian Hall was it?
That used to be a basketball court. And when I was in my sophomore year at Cardinal Hayes, we came
up here and played a little game with the Brothers, of basketball. So I've seen Marist grow from that to
how it is now. And in fact every time I come up here, I look...Marist looks like a university now with the
buildings, the style of the buildings and all like that.
GN (
22:26
):
It's almost West Point-like. With the gray stone and all of that.
WD (
22:30
):
It's really like...gee whiz it just looks like a university. So I am just pleased that I was able to get here and
to work on the Bob Norman. And you did some things to help me. I enjoyed this. I am enjoying this. I
enjoy it.
GN (
22:53
):
Okay. After Marist, you continued to teach in community college?
WD (
23:01
):
When I left Mar--oh, there is just, I'm just thinking...this is pertinent. I was offered an opportunity by
Dennis to go really and to look at pursuing a PhD so that I can get into real teaching now And he said
that they...Marist would assist me, and I thought about it long and hard and I said thanks, but really not
going to do it--health reasons. Because I have an affliction that I've had since I was in my forties,
diabetes and I take medication for it. And I just felt that that stress would cause me a problem.
GN (
23:59
):
Well, yeah. You're no youngster now either. You were 50-years-old.
WD (
24:04
):
No, right. And I said no, you know. It's like...yeah Marist...they helped me. I think that physically I would
not be able to do it. So I thanked them for that. And so they found me another position here and
so...when I left there, I left Marist in 19-, oh let me think here.
GN (
24:32
):
Late nineties?
WD (
24:34
):
1990, I think. And then I went to teach at my prior school--Westchester Community College--which was
now in Valhalla, New York, which is not far from White Plains. So I taught there for five years. And-
GN (
24:58
):
Did you find the students comparable? In other words, the same problems--nobody likes speaking. And
so-
WD (
25:06
):
Well, this is a two-year school. Marist is a four-year school. Most of the stuff--oh, plus I had several Army
veterans, Army Air Force veterans coming in there. And I found, for the most part the students were not
as sharp as Marist students at all. In a class of say 20 students, I would have about four or five who I
would call very, very nice, good students. The rest were not as nice...not so much nice, but good. So
that's the one thing that I found. But I was able to help them a lot. Because I was teaching public
speaking, and-
GN (
25:57
):
What were some of the...coming back to Marist, what were some of the personal accomplishments that
you think...when you think of Marist and your time here? I was happy to...some students in particular
get through, advisement to others, committee work, you know?
WD (
26:21
):
Well, two students really come to mind. Jerome Pickett, I had him in public speaking. Who is Jerome?
He's on the board right now. But I had him in public speaking class a number of years ago, and he
worked...when Obama was the president, he was an FBI agent. And he told us some nice stories about
things that went on with that. So him, plus Amy Wood. Amy Wood is the-
GN (
27:05
):
Director of Alumni.
WD (
27:08
):
Alumni person. So I'm sitting in my office one day and Bob and I--Bob Norman and I had an office
together here--and she comes in looking for an internship. So I sat down and talked to her, et cetera, et
cetera, et cetera. And she got an internship. I'm not sure where it was. I think it was NBC, but I'm not
sure. But look where she is now. So those are two of my keys to success.
GN (
27:39
):
Oh, is there a disappointment along the way? Someone or you felt that or...there are two different
questions here. If I said, what were some of the disappointments you experienced in students or the
college or in the buildings or whatever? Some classrooms that you had you found that this is not
adequate? I remember teaching at the bottom of Lowell Thomas.
WD (
28:10
):
Well, yes. One of the really big problems at the bottom of...down floor of Lowell Thomas, it was very,
very stuffy in there all the time. And I was always complaining about the air conditioning and it just
wasn't working right--this, that and the other thing. That was the biggest complaint, the bottom of
Lowell Thomas. Other than that...no, I don't...didn't have any complaints about the other classrooms. It
was just wonderful.
GN (
28:39
):
Okay. What do you see...there are two questions here now. If you had a chance to talk to the board
about some improvements at Marist...I mean, the air conditioning of course, you have to realize that all
the towers were built on the side of a swimming pool-
WD (
29:00
):
Yes, I heard about that.
GN (
29:00
):
And so, I mean, it was raw. Anyway...because it was a underground flow-through stream. That stream is
still down there. It's just that we kind of insulated ourselves from it. So I mean that's one point. But, is
there some buildings that...something you know about or have heard about that would be a good thing
for Marist? Parking might be something that the college could improve on.
WD (
29:29
):
Well you got the parking lot on the other side of Route 9 , which is fine. You can't do anything more.
You're filled up over here on this side of the road here. I'm trying to think what can we improve upon.
GN (
29:45
):
Well, there is one plan, but it's going to be hard to fulfill. And that is to build a high rise parking lot, and
they would put it in that space as you go down to the McCann Center, there is a parking spot right ahead
of you? At the foot of that big hill and then Sheahan is behind it. They could put a high rise there, but
they know already that it will cost $17,000 for every car parking space. You want to put it into a steel
structured, cement building to drive in. Do you have anybody in mind who wants to configure it into a
parking lot? [Laughter]
WD (
30:34
):
The one thing that I would say that has stayed with me from the time I came to Marist and
whatever...like I said, I was a technical writer. But the key thing for me is...the one thing that will help
students to advance in just about anything they do, is the ability to talk to an audience--in front of an
audience. So, do all students have to take public speaking?
GN (
31:09
):
I don't think so, no.
WD (
31:09
):
No. It should be requirement, I think. Every student should have a class in public speaking because I
don't care how smart you are or whatever, you need to talk to people. You need to talk to people. Look
at our legislators, they're all very good talking Democrats, Republicans, whatever. They're all talk very,
very well. And if you can speak well, you will influence people. And it will give you tremendous
satisfaction.
GN (
31:46
):
No, I think the only thing we have now is we want to be able to write. In other words, there is a writing
requirement that's there now. And I think I agree with you, it would also be important that there be a
speech requirement. That they be able to articulate and get in front of a group and even not in front of a
group. Even in a small group, I mean it doesn't have to be a large audience. Even talking to a small
committee of eight or 10, to be able to command their attention. I'm talking like you don't know this
[laughter]. I have a question that...on your crystal ball, what's your view of Marist maybe 10 years from
now?
WD (
32:33
):
10 years from now? I think I would like to see Marist as a university. I don't know if they got the space or
whatever, but it certainly looks like one now from just the shape of these buildings and whatever. It's
completely different than when I came here.
GN (
32:51
):
Oh yeah. We had...you're talking about that gym which was a...that was a multi-phase program. I mean,
there was a gym around the sides. There was a classroom, there was a printing shop, there was a
laundry in back, and there were garages on the other side. I was talking to people about it because I was
here as a young student when that was being constructed. But, do you feel that the advanced...I'm
trying to get the word...like distance learning? You know, computer classes off campus. How do you feel
about that?
WD (
33:35
):
This has been talked about a lot, classes off campus. I know it's going in all like that, but absolutely
nothing comes close than being in the classroom.
GN (
33:56
):
Why?
WD\ (
33:56
):
Why? Because when you're teaching at a distance, you might be home with your computer and you
might have say 20 or 30 students listening in. But they're not in the same room and they're listening to
you. It is not the same. It's physical presence. You need physical presence, and you need to be in the
classroom standing there talking to students because there would...there was certain things that I would
do, especially in the first class or two when I have students. I would stay in there and sometimes I would
tap my thumb and explain to them why I do things like that, and just get them at ease. You can't do that
on the computer. I don't care how much screen you have, how big the screen is. It's just not the same.
You need physical presence.
GN (
34:57
):
Alright, that was certainly one. What about the move to more technical computer education versus the
liberal arts that---we say we are a liberal arts college--to read, to be able to write, to talk, to have ideas
about philosophy and theology and the whole cosmos that we're in now that's ever expanding. That's
one area versus phone technologies to be able to move there-
WD (
35:33
):
Where's my phone [chuckling]? I put my phone [inaudible]. The world today is in the phone. Yeah. It's
here and it's nice use and all like that. In fact, I'll tell you when I was teaching here and also down in
Peekskill, students would have their phones and they did their talking and whatever, and their...it's a
distraction.
GN (
36:03
):
Yeah. One of the problems the administration has talked to me about here, just in the same question,
what is one of the needs? Students come out of the class and they're on their phone rather than talking
to somebody next to them they were in class with, they're calling home their girlfriend at home or their
boyfriend at home or their mother. There's a lot of--what do you call it? Helicopter parents, who
supervise almost everything that's happening on campus.
WD (
36:35
):
I ran into that a lot with students and phones, and I don't know how we get around that. But the key
thing is, that's the reason why you need to be in class with students, to tell them about different things.
GN (
36:48
):
Put your phones away [laughter].
WD (
36:50
):
Yeah. In fact, I had to tell students about it, put your phones away. So, but we know it's here to stay. But
students will be impressed more by physically being in the classroom and watching a teacher talk, and
their mannerisms and different things. And you can do this much better in person than someone
watching you on the screen doing something. Because you got physical presence.
GN (
37:21
):
Alright. The next question...the related part about programs at Marist. Are you aware...I'm sure some of
the advances now, we have medical technology, we have a physical...what is it...the physician's
assistance program, whether they're pseudo doctors coming out of the things. We have a doctoral
program in medical...physical therapy I think it is. So, it's not the same as a real PhD, but it is a doctoral
program. I mean it's-
WD (
38:05
):
They do get a degree and-?
GN (
38:07
):
They do get a doctorate, yeah and do that. Do you think Marist will lose a lot if we spend more on
graduate education than undergraduate? Shall we stay both ways or limit the growth?
WD (
38:24
):
You know, you'd have to stay both ways because you got to get students to come in here. Marist has a
tremendous reputation right now, and it's growing. And just seeing the growth of the school year in the
past what, 20 years, 25 years.
GN (
38:43
):
When I graduated we were 17 in my class, 1952. This year, there was 1,414 graduating undergraduates.
And then there were masters programs as well, which is even more. There is talk...now what would you
think about this, going to a medical school here as well? That fits a new ballpark really.
WD (
39:11
):
Well, if you're going to go...well, first of all, you got the physician's program. If you go more medical,
then you gotta be careful about not making it-
GN (
39:30
):
Too elite? [Chuckles]
WD (
39:31
):
Well, compared to the regular school...because I think a lot of students who come here not because of
the medical, but because of the other liberal arts and whatever. I think there's always room for liberal
arts.
GN (
39:50
):
You've come to a number of the sports programs. What do you think about the athletic programs here?
We've not won an awful lot in recent years, but we've had our share.
WD (
40:04
):
Alright, what am I thinking? I'm going to tell you. The women team, it's tremendous. They've always
been good with the coach you have here now. From day one, always great. The men's team has never
really been super okay. And I don't know what you can do about that because no matter what you try to
do, the men's portion team will not ever be as good as the women's because the coach has been here
tremendous and they've gone through a whole lot, the women's team. So the women's team it...the
men's team is not good.
GN (
40:53
):
Well, yes, but I mean, yeah, you need the horses to run in the race. And our ability to attract men high
school graduates to come here...I mean, again, Notre Dame, Michigan, Siena-
WD (
41:13
):
Seems like that. Oh, one thing I want to add, when I was teaching here, I would get some input from
some of the teachers who monitored, say the basketball team--the men's team--and they would ask me
how they are doing, this, that and the other thing. And I found that to be very nice because they really
followed these students and some of the students did well, others didn't do too well. But I never really
had any star players in any of my classes. The men's.
GN (
41:49
):
Oh, I had Rick Smith. And of course my story about him is that when he graduated, I talked about my
graduates. So they make up...the average salary is about a $100,000. I take his big millions. [Laughter]
WD (
42:07
):
I remember when I was here, I saw Rick Smith and he was always practicing, and I just knew that he
would really get into the NBA. And I think he was number third...the third one? Right from the little old
Marist College.
GN (
42:28
):
Of course, he came from Europe. I mean, he's not out of the Bronx, you know? He's not out of-
WD (
42:34
):
An education. And so he did very, very well.
GN (
42:40
):
The last point is of course, is a tricky one. It's this...basic question is Marist worth the investment? Now
think about what we're saying, investment? Investment is money. It's time. It's effort. You know, it's
personal...so you have to leave home for the most part to come. You gotta live on campus. You're going
to have to put a lot of time in to get to...you can't stay in the dormitory. They will have to go to class
here. You don't go to class and then you will fail out. So all of those things...and a lot of money.
$200,000, $50,000 a year now is the going rate. After four years, what kind of a job are you going to get?
So I said, why are you putting that money in when you can work as a mechanic or you can...how would
you answer somebody who would come to you with this question?
WD (
43:43
):
That's an excellent question and I will answer it this way. And I can say I'm a little biased, but I have
tremendous experience from working with other firms and all like that. Marist is a great school. Is it
worth it? Yes, it's worth it. It's worth it. Marist is worth it. In fact, my oldest grandson--from my
daughter's side--he graduated from here about five, six years ago. At first, he didn't want to come here.
His mother told me he didn't want to come. He wanted to go to some school in Philadelphia, and she sat
him down and explained to him that his stepfather works here, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. I talked to
him and she said also that the tremendous education that you will get here, plus the amount of financial
aid that they gave him compared to this other school. So make a long story short, he graduated from
here and he did well. He's got a good job and he's happy. But, Marist is a tremendous school.
GN (
45:09
):
So it's worth your investment?
WD (
45:10
):
Absolutely worth it.
GN (
45:12
):
Not necessarily because of a great job, but because of the experience, the life experience and-
WD (
45:18
):
No. It's the opportunities to travel and do things. Marist has satellites where? How many different
places overseas? Five, six, seven, whatever. A number of different countries you can go to to learn
what's going on with them. You need this because firms today, they need people who have broad minds
and who've been around. They just don't want the student who go to college, gets that A+ average but
hasn't done anything. Hasn't done any internship, hasn't traveled abroad. You need to have a wide
range of what the heck is going on.
GN (
46:00
):
Yeah. Something like a one and a half of Marist students now have an abroad experience between
Spain, England, Italy, Australia, Japan. I mean, it's worldwide.
WD (
46:15
):
Yeah, it grows the student and it's also beneficial to the firm that they're going to go to. They want
students who've been around. A student who just goes to college for four years and it hasn't gone out of
the country is going to be at a disadvantage
GN (
46:33
):
At the present time, I think there's more than 40 states represented in the student body. The diversity of
students that have come. I think there's something like 25 countries represented in the student body.
It's more than that, but I'm just making that number up. So, the question is the diversity here now as
well I think it's...would you encourage people to live on campus? Live the dorm experience if at all
possible?
WD (
47:11
):
Yes.
GN (
47:12
):
You would. Have you seen the new dorms?
WD (
47:15
):
I've been in the new dorms. I've seen them. It's like...it's wonderful. And I see students...they're young,
they want to be in a private house, so to speak. Where they can be together, drink a little bit or
whatever...be on campus.
GN (
47:35
):
Well, the older students can drink on campus in their rooms. I mean, we don't encourage but we can't
stop the choices that they make. And of course you probably have seen, we have taxis that take the
students out now. They lined up there in the Donnelley parking lot on a Thursday night. The weekend
starts on Thursday. So we start Thursday night, Friday night, Saturday night.
WD (
48:05
):
And the taxis take them around to Poughkeepsie area or-?
GN (
48:09
):
Wherever they want to go. I mean the college does not pay for the taxis. The taxis know there are
students here who want to ride. And so we certainly allow the taxis to come in. We'd rather the
students go by taxi then drive. So, well Bill it's 48 minutes or so we've been talking here. And you
certainly revealed an awful lot about your own background experience and we're that much richer for it.
Is there something I did not ask you about that you were dying to say or would like to say?
WD (
48:48
):
What I'm dying to say...you pretty well covered key things that I was thinking about. And I get back to
what I said before. Key thing for students here...you need to go abroad. Now, I'm not familiar with all of
the opportunities in different countries abroad, but they need to-
GN (
49:22
):
To see how other people live?
WD (
49:26
):
Well, not only to see how other people live...but the experience, the country. It'll make them better.
They can think better because right now, what do we have here? We have all these TVs. We have all of
these different firms. They're talking about what? Here and things, and they need to see what it's like
overseas. How do people overseas...what's on their televisions? We're too much a America Fi, as I would
say. They need to see what else out there. You know, Japan and Germany...different countries, they
need to experience this. Plus the fact that they need to not only experience this, but to be able to talk to
people. And you gain this from public speaking. I keep that name there, public speaking. They need to be
able to get in front of an audience and talk.
GN (
50:40
):
Okay, Bill. Thank you very much.
WD (
50:42
):
Your welcome.
“End of Interview”
Marist College
Poughkeepsie, NY
Transcribed by Kyra Walker
For the Marist College Archives and Special Collections
William Davis
Transcript – William Davis
Interviewee:
William Davis
Interviewer:
Gus Nolan
Interview Date:
5 September
2018
Location:
Marist Archives and Special Collections
Topic:
Marist College History
See Also:
MHP – Oral History
http://library.marist.edu/archives/oral_history.html
Subject Headings:
Davis, William
Marist College—History
Marist College (Poughkeepsie, N.Y.)
Marist College—Social Aspects
Marist College-Teaching
Summary:
William Davis talks of his time before working at Marist College, his career at Marist College,
the notable students that he’s taught and what he’d like to see for the college’s future.
Gus Nolan (
00:00
):
Today is September 5th, and we have an opportunity to have an interview with Bill Davis who is a
former professor here at Marist College in New York, English/Communication area; been here for a
number of years, but he has an interesting background before, during and after his time at Marist. So
good morning Bill.
William Davis (
00:29
):
Good morning Gus.
GN (
00:31
):
Bill, this is divided into four or five areas: one before Marist, coming to Marist, time in Marist, after
Marist. So that's kind of where we're going. So let's talk a little before Marist, the early years. Where
were you born, brought up, grade school, high school. Can you say a few words to that? Do you
remember?
WD (
00:54
):
[Laughter] I remember it just like it was almost yesterday. William, Bill Davis. I was born and raised in
New York City. Harlem, to be exact, between 138th street, somewhere around 138th street. And I went
to St. Marks, an Evangelist Catholic school, for eight years. And then, when I graduated--got my diploma
from there--I got an opportunity to go to Cardinal Hayes up on 650 Grand Concourse in the Bronx.
GN (
01:32
):
I know it well.
WD (
01:32
):
You know it well. It's a four-year school of course, but the first year I had to go down to St. Bernard's on
13th Street, a 113th street. So I commuted down there and then I went to Cardinal Hayes, the main
campus. And I took the standard curriculum, didn't know really what I wanted to do but I was always
a...what I call a bookworm. I love reading. I was in the library all the time in Cardinal Hayes. So I did that.
Actually my time in high school was spent within the four years...the first two years I did all of what you
supposed to do, go to classes and all like that. And I did work a little bit on the side. I did not get into
sports much. I was not a good basketball player. I'm tall--6' 3'--but I enjoyed what I did. And let me think
what's also significant-
GN (
02:44
):
Could you say something about work? Did you work during the summers? Afterschool?
WD (
02:49
):
I worked doing...oh that's a good thing, that's going way back. I worked after school. There was all kinds
of opportunities for jobs, everywhere in New York City because Cardinal Hayes still has a unique feeling
among a lot of people.
GN (
03:09
):
Give me a time span. Are we talking about the fifties or sixties? What time span?
WD (
03:13
):
Okay. This was 19...oh now let me see...1950. I graduated from St. Marks the Evangelist and I went to
Cardinal Hayes. So 1950 to 1954. So the first year I was in St Bernard's down on 113th Street.
GN (
03:32
):
Okay. Alright. I just want to get a handle about the...what was going on in the country and so on.
WD (
03:39
):
So...let's see here...so the first two years, I had one unique honor. I was very surprised that I was elected
class president in 2-U. That's the way they numbered the classes, 2-ABC. So it had a lot of students from
all over the city. So I was very, very pleased at that. And I didn't really get into the key sports there. We
had class intramurals and I was involved in that. Let's see...not playing basketball, but high jumping and
stuff like that. So I enjoyed that. So that was my first two years. The second year--going into the third
year, we had to make a decision whether we were going to go the academic route, to proceed to go to
college--four-year college or not. Now I come from a very, very poor background. It was myself, my
mother and my sister. My father had died earlier. So there was really no funds available to pay to go to
college. So, I really didn't go for a while, but I was thinking all along. And then what happened was I
went to the...I'm trying to think of what did they call it, the counseling area. And-
GN (
05:20
):
This is in high school?
WD (
05:21
):
This is up in Cardinal Hayes. And I said, I'd like to go to college, I says, but I'm looking at a two-year
college--city college, which was not far from me. You had to have an 85 average to go. I had an 83, so I
didn't even bother going there, but I found this one little school called Westchester Community College,
which was at the time up in White Plains. So I got a booklet and looked through it and I said, 'hey, I like
to look into this.' So I did look into it. I went up there and I talked to them and everything. I took a test
and everything and I got to go to Westchester Community College. So I commuted from 138st and
Grand Concourse because New York Central had a train stop there. So I'd get on the train in the morning
and within, I don't know, 30-35 minutes, I was in White Plains. So I love getting out of the city, but one
little tale. Before I was able to go to Westchester Community College in White Plains, I had to go to the
other community college in New York City in Brooklyn, and tell them why I wanted to go up there and
not in New York. And I said to them, well, I says I wanted to get into the country and it was easier and
quicker for me to take the train from 138st to White Plains than to take the subway to Brooklyn. So it
was very, very nice. I took electrical by the way.
GN (
07:06
):
Oh, you did?
WD (
07:06
):
Yes. Electrical, technology. I don't have a background in that, but I was just fascinated by it. So I did that
for two years. I got my associate's degree, and I did have a work assignment at Con Edison in Staten
Island--not Staten Island, I'm trying to think of where it was. One of the suburbs of New York.
GN (
07:31
):
City Island?
WD (
07:31
):
City Island, something like that--during the summer. So they had internships for all of the students
during the summer. So I was able to do that during the summer. Made a little bit of money.
GN (
07:45
):
What kind of work was it?
WD (
07:47
):
It was electrical work.
GN (
07:49
):
What kind of work? Switches? Wiring?
WD (
07:51
):
Nope, not wiring. They had these...I'm trying to think of the name they call it.
GN (
07:58
):
Just make up a name. We wouldn't know the difference.
WD (
08:00
):
Protectors. They had these circuit protectors for the poles and we had to sit at this little table--not a
table, but a seat and check out the wiring in it during the summer. So I did that, and thoroughly enjoyed
that. It was just fascinating. I was always fascinated by things electrical. So I did that for literally two
years and then I graduated, and I went looking for a job. Well, I looked at places. I interviewed with
General Electric in Syracuse, New York. So I interviewed, they offered me a job. So I says, 'my goodness,
I'm going to have to go to Syracuse.' So I went up there, but before I did that, in...let's see...at
Westchester Community College, I met my wife, Betty--Betty Hayes, and we became a couple. We
had...we got married, and then we went to Syracuse. So I worked at General Electric in a place called
Electronic Park, which was just north of Syracuse. So I was there for...I'm trying to think about it...three
years or something like that. And then I decided, 'hey, we really wanted to come back home to
Westchester. So something happened...in the meantime, my mother-in-law, her husband died and...so
she wondered if we would come back and live with her in Elmsford. So we decided to do that. So after
about three-four years at GE--which was a very, very good company and I thoroughly enjoyed it--we
came back and stayed with her for a couple of years. In the meantime--I told you I have a varied
background--other opportunities came up. I had about two or three different jobs, all electrical. And I
thoroughly enjoyed that. The one thing that really stands out for me, all the jobs I had, I worked at this
one firm which was in Tarrytown. It was called Simmons Precision. And what did they do? They made
fuel gauges for aircraft, and they and another company had the monopoly of this device for all of the
aircraft in the United States. And Simmons Precision had the main plant in Tarrytown, and they also had
a manufacturing facility up in Vergennes, Vermont.
GN (
11:27
):
That's way up north.
WD (
11:27
):
Right. So I commuted from Elmsford to Tarrytown, which wasn't too far. And then I was a technical
writer at the time, write technical manuals. So a couple of times I was able to go up to Vergennes,
Vermont using a company aircraft. So I'd go out to Westchester...I mean to the...what is it? The airport
in White Plains. I would get on the plane and the guy in the private plane would take me up to
Vergennes, Vermont. I would talk to some engineers about things regarding the technical manuals. And
so I produced several technical manuals regarding the fuel gauging on the aircraft that went on Apollo
11. Now I'm trying to think in my notes here. I have down here that Apollo 11 was the one that went to
the moon. So I did have a preliminary manual, but I'm sure that it was changed and all like that. But the
fact that I was able to get on the aircraft, go up to Vergennes, Vermont, talk to the engineer and come
back the same afternoon. It was absolutely wonderful.
GN (
12:58
):
Boy, this is very interesting Bill. I never saw this part of your life. I'm glad I have the opportunity to let
you tell it and to be recorded for Marist archives. So when they do a big research about the people who
came here and Marist and what it is...your past experiences are unique. Let me move quickly ahead
though because time is running on. What I have on my notes is something about...tell me about your
career at IBM. Longevity there and then you coming to Marist.
WD (
13:30
):
Okay. At IBM, I was a technical writer and I did that for a couple of years and then I got promoted to be
a manager of other technical writers. And then I got a promotion to be the technical communication
manager for the whole site of IBM, which was over 11,000 people.
GN (
13:57
):
Which IBM center is this?
WD (
13:59
):
In Fishkill, I worked in Fishkill. And so I had about five or six different, very experienced technical writers
who wrote and talked to engineers about different things that IBM was doing. And so I enjoyed that. I
was a manager for there for several years. And then let me see what happened-
GN (
14:28
):
Okay. Give me a...is this now in the eighties? When would you say this was?
WD (
14:32
):
This was...just hold tight here...this was in the sixties. In the sixties here. So I was in IBM from 1966 I
believe, to 1990. So I had a series of different positions-technical writer, publications manager. So yeah,
I did that.
GN (
14:59
):
Yeah. Very good. The other person I know at IBM when I was there was a guy called Jim Fahey who also-
WD (
15:07
):
Jim Fahey was the technical person there in the whole plant. And my boss at the time reported to him.
So I knew Jim.
GN (
15:26
):
I worked with him for a while and then eventually when I retired, he took my position here. So that was
kind of an exchange. Alright, tell me about your coming to Marist. How did that happen?
WD (
15:43
):
How did that happen? Well, tell you a little bit of history about IBM. From 1966 to 1986, it was straight-
line growth. It was just wonderful. We had a great job. We were making good salary and all like that. Life
was good. However, like everything else, other firms start coming along. Apple started coming along,
and IBM began to not to have a dominance in computers. Apples became the best ones around, so to
speak. So...let me think here now...so that was then, and I'm trying to think of the sequence here. I
think...what else? [Paper Rustling]
GN (
16:43
):
'86-90' your last-
WD (
16:47
):
Oh, yeah. '66 to '86. That's 1986...what IBM started doing was to start downsizing and closing some
plants. Word got around and I knew that things were going to change at IBM. They didn't tell us any
warning, but because I had worked at other companies, I knew how things worked because a lot of
people only work for IBM and they didn't have a sense of what it was like in the real world. So I knew
that things were changing. So I said, look, I need to do something. So they started downsizing the
technical writing area. The next thing I knew I was working for an engineering group as...what, I'm trying
to think of the title. I didn't really have...an aid more or less. So here I am with these highly technical
engineers and all I had was my experience--technical writing. To me, it wasn't enough. I needed to do
something else. So out of the blue--no one told me--I picked the phone one day and called Dennis
Murray. And I told Dennis that things are changing at IBM, and I'm looking for an opportunity to expand
my horizon. Well, that started the ball rolling. And then, oh my goodness, I had several interviews and all
like that and...I'm just trying to think of-
GN (
18:30
):
So that was an initiative you took? It was not responding to something you saw in the paper or
something?
WD (
18:36
):
Oh no. This is just strictly me, because like I said, I had worked at other firms and I knew how things
worked. So I says no...and anyway--to make a long story short, I was offered an opportunity and I came
to IBM. I was very, very pleased. I mean came to Marist. I'm very, very pleased with that.
GN (
18:56
):
Okay. And what did you do at Marist? What was the first thing you did?
WD (
19:01
):
Well, the first thing I did was...they set up a job for me...oh, working with Bob Norman; who was a key
person there, and he took me under his wing and we would go down to New York City to all of the-
GN (
19:22
):
This was the internship program?
WD (
19:24
):
Internship program. We went to all of the tv networks and all like that. He was telling me about different
people. And so we would go down there a lot. Like every couple of weeks we would take the train down
and go to ABC, CBS, NBC--all of them. And the radio stations too. But mostly it was the tv stations. So
met a lot of people and, he took me under his wing. And Bob Norman was just a unique person. He was
cool and quiet and very, very professional.
GN (
20:00
):
Oh yeah, I know him well. Okay. But, getting into actually teaching...you were doing public speaking? Or
writing? What did you do here at Marist?
WD (
20:14
):
Well I handled part-time the internship program along with Bob Norman. And then I started teaching.
And I'm trying to think of what my first job was...teaching public speaking. Because I did that a lot. So I
taught several classes in public speaking, and I would teach students how to get in front of an audience
to talk to people. And I found it absolutely terrifying for most students. The worst thing in the world
they wanted to do was stand in front of the-
GN (
20:59
):
Their own classmates.
WD (
21:01
):
Their classmates and talk. So one of the things that made it comfortable for me--because at IBM, I had
to talk to a lot of people in different areas and I was used to doing that, so...I taught that.
GN (
21:18
):
Yeah, okay. Turn the page now. Marist has changed considerably since you first came here with Bob
Norman. What strikes you most? Is it the buildings? Is it the student body? Is it the academic program?
What would you say is...physically there's been a lot of changes, but maybe that's not the first thing.
WD (
21:42
):
Okay, physically there's been a lot of change for me. For me, it's personal. One of the things that I didn't
tell you about, the...one of the dorms here that used to be the basketball court...Marian Hall was it?
That used to be a basketball court. And when I was in my sophomore year at Cardinal Hayes, we came
up here and played a little game with the Brothers, of basketball. So I've seen Marist grow from that to
how it is now. And in fact every time I come up here, I look...Marist looks like a university now with the
buildings, the style of the buildings and all like that.
GN (
22:26
):
It's almost West Point-like. With the gray stone and all of that.
WD (
22:30
):
It's really like...gee whiz it just looks like a university. So I am just pleased that I was able to get here and
to work on the Bob Norman. And you did some things to help me. I enjoyed this. I am enjoying this. I
enjoy it.
GN (
22:53
):
Okay. After Marist, you continued to teach in community college?
WD (
23:01
):
When I left Mar--oh, there is just, I'm just thinking...this is pertinent. I was offered an opportunity by
Dennis to go really and to look at pursuing a PhD so that I can get into real teaching now And he said
that they...Marist would assist me, and I thought about it long and hard and I said thanks, but really not
going to do it--health reasons. Because I have an affliction that I've had since I was in my forties,
diabetes and I take medication for it. And I just felt that that stress would cause me a problem.
GN (
23:59
):
Well, yeah. You're no youngster now either. You were 50-years-old.
WD (
24:04
):
No, right. And I said no, you know. It's like...yeah Marist...they helped me. I think that physically I would
not be able to do it. So I thanked them for that. And so they found me another position here and
so...when I left there, I left Marist in 19-, oh let me think here.
GN (
24:32
):
Late nineties?
WD (
24:34
):
1990, I think. And then I went to teach at my prior school--Westchester Community College--which was
now in Valhalla, New York, which is not far from White Plains. So I taught there for five years. And-
GN (
24:58
):
Did you find the students comparable? In other words, the same problems--nobody likes speaking. And
so-
WD (
25:06
):
Well, this is a two-year school. Marist is a four-year school. Most of the stuff--oh, plus I had several Army
veterans, Army Air Force veterans coming in there. And I found, for the most part the students were not
as sharp as Marist students at all. In a class of say 20 students, I would have about four or five who I
would call very, very nice, good students. The rest were not as nice...not so much nice, but good. So
that's the one thing that I found. But I was able to help them a lot. Because I was teaching public
speaking, and-
GN (
25:57
):
What were some of the...coming back to Marist, what were some of the personal accomplishments that
you think...when you think of Marist and your time here? I was happy to...some students in particular
get through, advisement to others, committee work, you know?
WD (
26:21
):
Well, two students really come to mind. Jerome Pickett, I had him in public speaking. Who is Jerome?
He's on the board right now. But I had him in public speaking class a number of years ago, and he
worked...when Obama was the president, he was an FBI agent. And he told us some nice stories about
things that went on with that. So him, plus Amy Wood. Amy Wood is the-
GN (
27:05
):
Director of Alumni.
WD (
27:08
):
Alumni person. So I'm sitting in my office one day and Bob and I--Bob Norman and I had an office
together here--and she comes in looking for an internship. So I sat down and talked to her, et cetera, et
cetera, et cetera. And she got an internship. I'm not sure where it was. I think it was NBC, but I'm not
sure. But look where she is now. So those are two of my keys to success.
GN (
27:39
):
Oh, is there a disappointment along the way? Someone or you felt that or...there are two different
questions here. If I said, what were some of the disappointments you experienced in students or the
college or in the buildings or whatever? Some classrooms that you had you found that this is not
adequate? I remember teaching at the bottom of Lowell Thomas.
WD (
28:10
):
Well, yes. One of the really big problems at the bottom of...down floor of Lowell Thomas, it was very,
very stuffy in there all the time. And I was always complaining about the air conditioning and it just
wasn't working right--this, that and the other thing. That was the biggest complaint, the bottom of
Lowell Thomas. Other than that...no, I don't...didn't have any complaints about the other classrooms. It
was just wonderful.
GN (
28:39
):
Okay. What do you see...there are two questions here now. If you had a chance to talk to the board
about some improvements at Marist...I mean, the air conditioning of course, you have to realize that all
the towers were built on the side of a swimming pool-
WD (
29:00
):
Yes, I heard about that.
GN (
29:00
):
And so, I mean, it was raw. Anyway...because it was a underground flow-through stream. That stream is
still down there. It's just that we kind of insulated ourselves from it. So I mean that's one point. But, is
there some buildings that...something you know about or have heard about that would be a good thing
for Marist? Parking might be something that the college could improve on.
WD (
29:29
):
Well you got the parking lot on the other side of Route 9 , which is fine. You can't do anything more.
You're filled up over here on this side of the road here. I'm trying to think what can we improve upon.
GN (
29:45
):
Well, there is one plan, but it's going to be hard to fulfill. And that is to build a high rise parking lot, and
they would put it in that space as you go down to the McCann Center, there is a parking spot right ahead
of you? At the foot of that big hill and then Sheahan is behind it. They could put a high rise there, but
they know already that it will cost $17,000 for every car parking space. You want to put it into a steel
structured, cement building to drive in. Do you have anybody in mind who wants to configure it into a
parking lot? [Laughter]
WD (
30:34
):
The one thing that I would say that has stayed with me from the time I came to Marist and
whatever...like I said, I was a technical writer. But the key thing for me is...the one thing that will help
students to advance in just about anything they do, is the ability to talk to an audience--in front of an
audience. So, do all students have to take public speaking?
GN (
31:09
):
I don't think so, no.
WD (
31:09
):
No. It should be requirement, I think. Every student should have a class in public speaking because I
don't care how smart you are or whatever, you need to talk to people. You need to talk to people. Look
at our legislators, they're all very good talking Democrats, Republicans, whatever. They're all talk very,
very well. And if you can speak well, you will influence people. And it will give you tremendous
satisfaction.
GN (
31:46
):
No, I think the only thing we have now is we want to be able to write. In other words, there is a writing
requirement that's there now. And I think I agree with you, it would also be important that there be a
speech requirement. That they be able to articulate and get in front of a group and even not in front of a
group. Even in a small group, I mean it doesn't have to be a large audience. Even talking to a small
committee of eight or 10, to be able to command their attention. I'm talking like you don't know this
[laughter]. I have a question that...on your crystal ball, what's your view of Marist maybe 10 years from
now?
WD (
32:33
):
10 years from now? I think I would like to see Marist as a university. I don't know if they got the space or
whatever, but it certainly looks like one now from just the shape of these buildings and whatever. It's
completely different than when I came here.
GN (
32:51
):
Oh yeah. We had...you're talking about that gym which was a...that was a multi-phase program. I mean,
there was a gym around the sides. There was a classroom, there was a printing shop, there was a
laundry in back, and there were garages on the other side. I was talking to people about it because I was
here as a young student when that was being constructed. But, do you feel that the advanced...I'm
trying to get the word...like distance learning? You know, computer classes off campus. How do you feel
about that?
WD (
33:35
):
This has been talked about a lot, classes off campus. I know it's going in all like that, but absolutely
nothing comes close than being in the classroom.
GN (
33:56
):
Why?
WD\ (
33:56
):
Why? Because when you're teaching at a distance, you might be home with your computer and you
might have say 20 or 30 students listening in. But they're not in the same room and they're listening to
you. It is not the same. It's physical presence. You need physical presence, and you need to be in the
classroom standing there talking to students because there would...there was certain things that I would
do, especially in the first class or two when I have students. I would stay in there and sometimes I would
tap my thumb and explain to them why I do things like that, and just get them at ease. You can't do that
on the computer. I don't care how much screen you have, how big the screen is. It's just not the same.
You need physical presence.
GN (
34:57
):
Alright, that was certainly one. What about the move to more technical computer education versus the
liberal arts that---we say we are a liberal arts college--to read, to be able to write, to talk, to have ideas
about philosophy and theology and the whole cosmos that we're in now that's ever expanding. That's
one area versus phone technologies to be able to move there-
WD (
35:33
):
Where's my phone [chuckling]? I put my phone [inaudible]. The world today is in the phone. Yeah. It's
here and it's nice use and all like that. In fact, I'll tell you when I was teaching here and also down in
Peekskill, students would have their phones and they did their talking and whatever, and their...it's a
distraction.
GN (
36:03
):
Yeah. One of the problems the administration has talked to me about here, just in the same question,
what is one of the needs? Students come out of the class and they're on their phone rather than talking
to somebody next to them they were in class with, they're calling home their girlfriend at home or their
boyfriend at home or their mother. There's a lot of--what do you call it? Helicopter parents, who
supervise almost everything that's happening on campus.
WD (
36:35
):
I ran into that a lot with students and phones, and I don't know how we get around that. But the key
thing is, that's the reason why you need to be in class with students, to tell them about different things.
GN (
36:48
):
Put your phones away [laughter].
WD (
36:50
):
Yeah. In fact, I had to tell students about it, put your phones away. So, but we know it's here to stay. But
students will be impressed more by physically being in the classroom and watching a teacher talk, and
their mannerisms and different things. And you can do this much better in person than someone
watching you on the screen doing something. Because you got physical presence.
GN (
37:21
):
Alright. The next question...the related part about programs at Marist. Are you aware...I'm sure some of
the advances now, we have medical technology, we have a physical...what is it...the physician's
assistance program, whether they're pseudo doctors coming out of the things. We have a doctoral
program in medical...physical therapy I think it is. So, it's not the same as a real PhD, but it is a doctoral
program. I mean it's-
WD (
38:05
):
They do get a degree and-?
GN (
38:07
):
They do get a doctorate, yeah and do that. Do you think Marist will lose a lot if we spend more on
graduate education than undergraduate? Shall we stay both ways or limit the growth?
WD (
38:24
):
You know, you'd have to stay both ways because you got to get students to come in here. Marist has a
tremendous reputation right now, and it's growing. And just seeing the growth of the school year in the
past what, 20 years, 25 years.
GN (
38:43
):
When I graduated we were 17 in my class, 1952. This year, there was 1,414 graduating undergraduates.
And then there were masters programs as well, which is even more. There is talk...now what would you
think about this, going to a medical school here as well? That fits a new ballpark really.
WD (
39:11
):
Well, if you're going to go...well, first of all, you got the physician's program. If you go more medical,
then you gotta be careful about not making it-
GN (
39:30
):
Too elite? [Chuckles]
WD (
39:31
):
Well, compared to the regular school...because I think a lot of students who come here not because of
the medical, but because of the other liberal arts and whatever. I think there's always room for liberal
arts.
GN (
39:50
):
You've come to a number of the sports programs. What do you think about the athletic programs here?
We've not won an awful lot in recent years, but we've had our share.
WD (
40:04
):
Alright, what am I thinking? I'm going to tell you. The women team, it's tremendous. They've always
been good with the coach you have here now. From day one, always great. The men's team has never
really been super okay. And I don't know what you can do about that because no matter what you try to
do, the men's portion team will not ever be as good as the women's because the coach has been here
tremendous and they've gone through a whole lot, the women's team. So the women's team it...the
men's team is not good.
GN (
40:53
):
Well, yes, but I mean, yeah, you need the horses to run in the race. And our ability to attract men high
school graduates to come here...I mean, again, Notre Dame, Michigan, Siena-
WD (
41:13
):
Seems like that. Oh, one thing I want to add, when I was teaching here, I would get some input from
some of the teachers who monitored, say the basketball team--the men's team--and they would ask me
how they are doing, this, that and the other thing. And I found that to be very nice because they really
followed these students and some of the students did well, others didn't do too well. But I never really
had any star players in any of my classes. The men's.
GN (
41:49
):
Oh, I had Rick Smith. And of course my story about him is that when he graduated, I talked about my
graduates. So they make up...the average salary is about a $100,000. I take his big millions. [Laughter]
WD (
42:07
):
I remember when I was here, I saw Rick Smith and he was always practicing, and I just knew that he
would really get into the NBA. And I think he was number third...the third one? Right from the little old
Marist College.
GN (
42:28
):
Of course, he came from Europe. I mean, he's not out of the Bronx, you know? He's not out of-
WD (
42:34
):
An education. And so he did very, very well.
GN (
42:40
):
The last point is of course, is a tricky one. It's this...basic question is Marist worth the investment? Now
think about what we're saying, investment? Investment is money. It's time. It's effort. You know, it's
personal...so you have to leave home for the most part to come. You gotta live on campus. You're going
to have to put a lot of time in to get to...you can't stay in the dormitory. They will have to go to class
here. You don't go to class and then you will fail out. So all of those things...and a lot of money.
$200,000, $50,000 a year now is the going rate. After four years, what kind of a job are you going to get?
So I said, why are you putting that money in when you can work as a mechanic or you can...how would
you answer somebody who would come to you with this question?
WD (
43:43
):
That's an excellent question and I will answer it this way. And I can say I'm a little biased, but I have
tremendous experience from working with other firms and all like that. Marist is a great school. Is it
worth it? Yes, it's worth it. It's worth it. Marist is worth it. In fact, my oldest grandson--from my
daughter's side--he graduated from here about five, six years ago. At first, he didn't want to come here.
His mother told me he didn't want to come. He wanted to go to some school in Philadelphia, and she sat
him down and explained to him that his stepfather works here, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. I talked to
him and she said also that the tremendous education that you will get here, plus the amount of financial
aid that they gave him compared to this other school. So make a long story short, he graduated from
here and he did well. He's got a good job and he's happy. But, Marist is a tremendous school.
GN (
45:09
):
So it's worth your investment?
WD (
45:10
):
Absolutely worth it.
GN (
45:12
):
Not necessarily because of a great job, but because of the experience, the life experience and-
WD (
45:18
):
No. It's the opportunities to travel and do things. Marist has satellites where? How many different
places overseas? Five, six, seven, whatever. A number of different countries you can go to to learn
what's going on with them. You need this because firms today, they need people who have broad minds
and who've been around. They just don't want the student who go to college, gets that A+ average but
hasn't done anything. Hasn't done any internship, hasn't traveled abroad. You need to have a wide
range of what the heck is going on.
GN (
46:00
):
Yeah. Something like a one and a half of Marist students now have an abroad experience between
Spain, England, Italy, Australia, Japan. I mean, it's worldwide.
WD (
46:15
):
Yeah, it grows the student and it's also beneficial to the firm that they're going to go to. They want
students who've been around. A student who just goes to college for four years and it hasn't gone out of
the country is going to be at a disadvantage
GN (
46:33
):
At the present time, I think there's more than 40 states represented in the student body. The diversity of
students that have come. I think there's something like 25 countries represented in the student body.
It's more than that, but I'm just making that number up. So, the question is the diversity here now as
well I think it's...would you encourage people to live on campus? Live the dorm experience if at all
possible?
WD (
47:11
):
Yes.
GN (
47:12
):
You would. Have you seen the new dorms?
WD (
47:15
):
I've been in the new dorms. I've seen them. It's like...it's wonderful. And I see students...they're young,
they want to be in a private house, so to speak. Where they can be together, drink a little bit or
whatever...be on campus.
GN (
47:35
):
Well, the older students can drink on campus in their rooms. I mean, we don't encourage but we can't
stop the choices that they make. And of course you probably have seen, we have taxis that take the
students out now. They lined up there in the Donnelley parking lot on a Thursday night. The weekend
starts on Thursday. So we start Thursday night, Friday night, Saturday night.
WD (
48:05
):
And the taxis take them around to Poughkeepsie area or-?
GN (
48:09
):
Wherever they want to go. I mean the college does not pay for the taxis. The taxis know there are
students here who want to ride. And so we certainly allow the taxis to come in. We'd rather the
students go by taxi then drive. So, well Bill it's 48 minutes or so we've been talking here. And you
certainly revealed an awful lot about your own background experience and we're that much richer for it.
Is there something I did not ask you about that you were dying to say or would like to say?
WD (
48:48
):
What I'm dying to say...you pretty well covered key things that I was thinking about. And I get back to
what I said before. Key thing for students here...you need to go abroad. Now, I'm not familiar with all of
the opportunities in different countries abroad, but they need to-
GN (
49:22
):
To see how other people live?
WD (
49:26
):
Well, not only to see how other people live...but the experience, the country. It'll make them better.
They can think better because right now, what do we have here? We have all these TVs. We have all of
these different firms. They're talking about what? Here and things, and they need to see what it's like
overseas. How do people overseas...what's on their televisions? We're too much a America Fi, as I would
say. They need to see what else out there. You know, Japan and Germany...different countries, they
need to experience this. Plus the fact that they need to not only experience this, but to be able to talk to
people. And you gain this from public speaking. I keep that name there, public speaking. They need to be
able to get in front of an audience and talk.
GN (
50:40
):
Okay, Bill. Thank you very much.
WD (
50:42
):
Your welcome.
“End of Interview”