ANNAMARIA MACIOCIA

Marist College
Poughkeepsie, NY
Transcribed by Ann Sandri
For the Marist College Archives and Special Collections
















Maciocia, Annamaria






Transcript – Annamaria Maciocia
Interviewee:
Maciocia, Annamaria
Interviewer:
Jan Stivers
Interview Date:
January 6, 2022

Location:
Marist Archives and Special Collections
Topic:
Marist College History

Subject Headings:
Marist College History
Marist College (Poughkeepsie, New York)
Marist College Social Aspects





Summary:
In this interview Professor Maciocia speaks about her early years and what brought
her to the Hudson Valley. She discusses her education at Vassar College and her early career
before coming to Marist College. Annamaria talks about the Para-Legal Program at Marist in
depth and its growth over the years. She speaks about the leadership of the college and where
she thinks it is headed in the future.









Jan Stivers (
00:00:01
):
And I'll start for the record by saying that this is Thursday, January 6th, 2022. My name is Jan Stivers and
I'm interviewing professor Annamaria Maciocia for the Marist College Oral History Project. And the
purpose of the project is to capture the experiences of members of the Marist community who played
an active role in the development of the college. And I'm grateful to you, Annamaria, for this
contribution to the archives.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:00:31
):
I'm grateful to be here. I'm very excited about the opportunity to participate. And I hope that, you know,
I have something that I can contribute, but it's a tremendous privilege to be here. So thank you.
Jan Stivers (
00:00:44
):
It's gonna be a pleasure too. <laugh> so I'd like to start with questions about your background. If you
could tell me where, and when you were born about the family you were born into.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:00:55
):
Oh, I was born November 8th, 1966, in Queens.
Jan Stivers (
00:01:02
):
Oh, in Queens. Okay. I just assumed you had been a local family.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:01:05
):
Yeah. And in in Italian American family, <affirmative> the second daughter, the second child to my
parents who both immigrated from Italy. So my sister and I are first generation to go to college and first
generation to be born in the United States.
Jan Stivers (
00:01:25
):
Yeah. Yeah. Wow
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:01:27
):
And so we you know, having, being born in Queens in a, in Italian American family whose Catholic, went
to Catholic schools for the first 12 years and my sister is older, eight years older than I, so I always had
sort of the, experience of, or I should say I had the benefit of her experiences, as they, you know, related
to, you know, her breakthrough in terms of education, going to college. Yeah. Going to college, the
outside world. And so I went to St Leo's grammar school, St. Leo's school in Corona, Queens. Yeah. In
Corona. Yes, my high school St. Francis Prep in Fresh Meadows. And when my parents I guess, as we
were growing, I wanna say probably I was very much an infant, so my sister who's eight years older was
seven. She could relate to this better, but my parents started to venture out on the weekends and
started to come to upstate New York to spend the weekends because they just felt that it was a pleasant
reminder of their own childhood, where they were in a local, very rural town in, um Abruzzi, in Italy
<affirmative>. And so they loved, you know, Ulster County, which is an area that they visited frequently.
And there were
Jan Stivers (
00:03:20
):
There were boarding houses in the Plattekill area


Annamaria Maciocia (
00:03:22
):
Yes. And so they did, they
Jan Stivers (
00:03:25
):
Sadie Penzatta wrote about them. Do you know Sadie? No. Oh, I we'll talk about her afterwards.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:03:29
):
Wow. That I'd love to read about that. I know that my parents would come up usually for a day, but it
would be like a day where they would go either apple picking or tomato picking or, you know, it would, a
lot of it had connection to food because they wanted to you know, be able to make, either, you know,
have a canning project or have some sort of tomato meat sauce, making, you know, tomatoes and stuff
like that. So that was always very much a backyard project in Queens. And so they started coming up
now, by the time I was one we had already, my parents had acquired a farm upstate.
Jan Stivers (
00:04:20
):
Oh my gosh.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:04:21
):
Yeah. So they, they did, they had saved their money and they had purchased a 45 acre property in the
Town of Plattekill, which always served as a weekend home and as an eventual retirement place. So we
always lived with our extended family, which meant my maternal grandparents and my paternal
grandmother. So
Jan Stivers (
00:04:56
):
So, they were in this country too. They had come from this country
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:04:58
):
Yes, they loved the Ulster County area. And so the grandparents, as quickly as they were able to retire
from their, you know, various jobs, they moved to the farm permanently, which of course meant that,
you know, we had like a summer house, you know, it was always functioning and we had, and on the
weekends we would come up to Ulster county. And so I, and my parents also eventually did just that
they retired and, you know, moved up full time. So when I was looking at colleges, I knew that it was the
intention of my parents to move eventually. So I, Vassar College is where I completed my bachelor's
that's where I attended. And then Albany Law School. Yeah. Yeah.
Jan Stivers (
00:05:56
):
Well, that was one, one of my questions is what made you choose Vassar? Well, location was one part
of it.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:06:03
):
Location was a tremendous part of it. I lived at home while I went to Vassar mm-hmm <affirmative>. But
it was located where you know, I guess the proximity you know, was just perfect for being able to go
home and also be able to have a good college experience, which that was always very important to my
parents. That we went to the best possible schools. They saw that as part of their obligation


Jan Stivers (
00:06:40
):
Parental obligation?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:06:40
):
Absolutely.
Jan Stivers (
00:06:42
):
So, I imagine Vassar was very different from St. Francis Prep, the culture.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:06:50
):
Yes. Yes. It was.
Jan Stivers (
00:06:52
):
Especially at the time that you're talking about. So you went to Vassar, you were born in 66, did you say,
so you went to Vassar,
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:07:01
):
Uh, 80, 84. Okay. To, and I graduated in 87. I completed my studies at Vassar in three, three years. So I,
have took, heavy course loads each semester and took summer classes as well
Jan Stivers (
00:07:19
):
As a day student?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:07:20
):
Yeah. So, and I...
Jan Stivers (
00:07:25
):
How did you find Vassar? What was that experience like for you?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:07:29
):
Well, you know, I found that the faculty were just these extraordinary people, all of them were so, just
dedicated and diligent in their fields. <affirmative>, you know, and these were people who
Jan Stivers (
00:07:52
):
Two, three load, lends itself to that
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:07:56
):
<laugh> yeah. Who had you know, written books. And I could tell that, although, you know, I came from
a high school where the faculty was just incredible as well. <affirmative>, and I had an excellent
experience there. The the faculty at Vassar were, you know, incredibly diligent, intelligent people, very
driven. And they had expectations that, you know, I could immediately sense were a challenge and that
they could not be disappointed <affirmative>. So I think it was in that way. It was a good fit ,
<affirmative> it was a good fit. And quite frankly, I was so busy while I was there that it just kept me, you
know, motivated <affirmative> and it kept me going, so I really did enjoy, and the kinds of coursework


that I was able to do was just you know, the studying, taking a course and English that was devoted to,
you know, revenge tragedy plays.
Jan Stivers (
00:09:16
):
Wow.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:09:16
):
Rather than, you know, just...
Jan Stivers (
00:09:18
):
British literature. Yeah. Yeah.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:09:19
):
Just doing like very specific, just diving deep. And so I appreciated the curriculum and I appreciated you
know, some of the nuances, you know, having eight people in my class that was great. And calculus,
yeah. There were people and a collegue that attend my math class and that's just, you know, how it was.
And it was great to ask questions and I just, I found the experience to be one that made me work. I did
not want to disappoint and I wanted to, you know, I wanted to succeed at the opportunity that my
parents had given me.
Jan Stivers (
00:10:14
):
Mm-hmm <affirmative>, I imagine that in a few minutes, we'll talk about how that has influenced your
own teaching. You know, you became a college teacher and but before we get to that what made you
decide to study law?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:10:32
):
Well, I have always, since I can remember, I always wanted to be an attorney really, and it was a very
unlikely match <laugh> because I was always a more quiet or reserved individual, but I always saw law
as a way to resolve problems as a way to solve things. <affirmative>, you know, and so even from when I
was, I can remember in the seventh grade, you know, just having different speakers who would come to
school and different careers and just in that engagement, I think I would, I just saw that this was an
opportunity to really help people. And even within my own family, you know, there are so many
barriers, language is a barrier education is a barrier and those barriers create fear. And so lawyers are
really able to sort of, you know, just make the fear go away and are able to make a path where someone
can see their way forward. And so I...
Jan Stivers (
00:12:01
):
It's quite beautiful Annamaria. It's really beautiful to, to think about to your profession in that way.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:12:07
):
And so I always saw the law in that way, and I guess there were individuals along the way who would
say, do you really think that you wanna do that because you don't, I don't have a what, you know, would
be characterized as this you know, charismatic or, you know, this ability, this aggressive ability
Jan Stivers (
00:12:35
):


Adversarial?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:12:37
):
Yes. Yeah and I think I just, I don't see the law that way and so that did not really hinder my, and then I
just, my parents were just always very incredibly supportive. Like, if you want to do something, then,
you know, you can do it because you just keep moving toward your goal. And what you want to be will
invite who you are in. You don't have to fit someone else's definition <affirmative> of what a lawyer, of
how a lawyer behaves or how, you know, so that was always, and I think that's from being immigrants, I
think they, themselves had so many times they had to accept that. And so, that was always very much
part of what, you know, we were told. And I always saw, you know, lawyers as being helpful. And as you
know, my parents had real estate transactions. And so, you know, these individuals always seemed to be
able to explain documents and make things that were sometimes very, you know, mysterious or
menacing, just able to break things down. And I guess, being in the presence of these individuals
Jan Stivers (
00:14:03
):
Mm-hmm <affirmative> yeah, yeah, yeah. That's, that's wonderful. One of my earlier questions was how
would you know about the work of a lawyer? And it would really be through your parents' experiences
as their world expanded upstate.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:14:18
):
Yeah., right. As their world expanded also.
Jan Stivers (
00:14:21
):
I mean, they did come from Italy. It's not like they went into small world. Yeah. They crossed the ocean
and established home here.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:14:30
):
Right. And they had to.
Jan Stivers (
00:14:30
):
And did they bring their parents over?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:14:33
):
Yes. So that's how and the entire, and that, you know, the entire family, the only grandparent I didn't
meet because he was killed in World War II was my father's father <affirmative>. And so, and that was,
you know, my father was three at the time, <affirmative>, we were always an incredibly close family
<affirmative>. And I always had that, you know, very loving and supportive <affirmative> framework
<affirmative>. And I think that that really, you know, helps an individual find their way. Yeah. Yeah. And
of course, so the environment at Vassar had a different take, you know, there was different spin and I
would go home sometimes and I would engage my mother and like, do you know, you know, what these
things are? And, you know, my mother would say, look, she'd say, I know who you are, you know, who
you are, and you need to be who you are, and other people are gonna be who they are. You are, you're
not at Vassar to you know, to give up your identity, you're at Vassar to learn you're at Vassar to grow
and, and there's a right way to do that. Right. And so I think she was always you know, just, you know,
very pragmatic. I don't know if you recall, but I gave a small, I do a small talk about how I, you know,


stumbled into, my biology major. Right? So here I was at Vassar and I didn't know what to major in. I
loved English history, political science with Sydney Plotkin he was just so dynamic <affirmative>. And I,
you know, I wanted to major in everything and we were assigned these random advisors and I had
Charles Briggs, an anthropologist as my first year advisor. And I think I went to see him just about every
other day with, "what am I gonna major in?" Here are the pros for history, here are the cons for history.
Here are the, you know, everything was a list. And so, I think he was just, you know, he just didn't know
what to do with me. So he said, all right. He said, what are the harder subjects? I said, well, math and
science. He said, that's where you need to pick your major. So I got this advice and within 10 minutes, I
walked from Blodgett to Main and I handed in my card, majoring in biology, and I thought, I've checked
that off. Okay. I'm gonna go off. And I think maybe that was the quote/unquote Catholic school girl
<laugh>, <affirmative> of organizing, like I have to pick a major and I can't be, and if this, and it's anxiety
producing, not to have that choice made correct. And the longer you dwell in like, oh, you know, I love
these things. I love them all equally. How can I give up two, to pick one and you know, all this stuff, so,
Jan Stivers (
00:17:54
):
Oh, that's a great story.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:17:55
):
And so then, you know, there go and then I get into some of the blood instance where you're really
tested, where you're really tested where you said, okay, here's the anatomy and physiology lab. And
now, you know, you've got to, you've got to, do dissection, the dissection, and guess what we have live
rats. And, you know, you need to kill the rat and or at least stun the rat, you know, the idea was we had
to take them by their tails and hit the back of their heads, the edge of a lab table. And I mean, these rats
were biting people. They were escaping. It was, it was just, there was mayhem in that room. And that's
where I thought to myself, I'm like, oh, now at this time on the farm, I was living with my grandparents
and my parents would come up every weekend, but they still had their work in the city. They still had
their business. So I said, oh my, and of course I have, you know, people around me who are taking
positions, taking stands and, you know, making decisions. And here I am. And I'm like, I, I just, I don't
know what to do. And that's when I call and I make that, that call to my mother. And, you know, she's
like, listen, I can't tell you what you have to do here. She, but essentially, you know, reminds me says,
look, you know, W's, aren't always available out there, you know, the whole world isn't, you know, going
give you the chance for a W <affirmative> . And that's where I think I, you know, realized, I said, I've go
in there...
Jan Stivers (
00:19:44
):
I didn't get that.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:19:46
):
I've gotta go in there and kill that rat, which is what I did <laugh> just what I end up doing. And at that
point, I think, I just felt like, okay, I mean, this is horrible, but I've done it. And I'm ready to proceed with
this, you know, lab, and we're gonna, you know, get through this.
Jan Stivers (
00:20:10
):
Did you remain a biology major? You graduated with a major in bio from Vassar?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:20:16
):


Yes. Yes I did. Because, you know, to change the major, would've meant an extra semester and that
would've meant extra money. Tuition. Yeah. And I just know that it was a challenge. It was a hardship for
my parents. And so I could not in good faith, put them through that. I said, I made this choice.
Jan Stivers (
00:20:42
):
And the reality is that what you gained from that experience developed your thinking skills, your
analytics skills, your approach to problem solving those things, carry over to wherever you're going.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:20:55
):
And that's exactly correct at the end. I think I had to do a reflection about my major, would I major in
anything different? And I think, you know, my answer was, no, I wouldn't have majored in anything
different because it was essentially just an opportunity to learn about the world maybe through the lens
of a discipline little bit more, but you've had the benefit of that wonderful liberal arts education all
around. And, you know, you had maybe that opportunity to confront things that you were less
comfortable with.
Jan Stivers (
00:21:33
):
Yes. Yes.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:21:34
):
Now that being said, as an advisor to students who want to go to law school, I do not ask them to
identify the areas of greatest struggle. Right.
Jan Stivers (
00:21:49
):
I tell them to go with their strengths.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:21:51
):
Exactly.
Jan Stivers (
00:21:52
):
Nurture Your strengths, develop your strengths.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:21:54
):
Nurture your strengths. Because I think that by pursuing those, you develop a passion for what you
study. And I really just, I wanna think about the undergraduate experience, not just as preparation for
law school, but as preparation for your whole life. Yes. And if you can find that area, that field, that
inspires you, that I think that not only will you develop everything that you need to be ready for your
one hour year, but for your whole, you have almost like a first love there that for your whole life you
have a way of looking at the world a way of ordering things, a way of making sense of things that is
something that you thoroughly enjoy
Jan Stivers (
00:22:54
):
And the experience of mastering it. Yes, you know, reaching a point hopefully of excellence and then
bringing that forward with you, that awareness that you can achieve excellence. What a good thing.


Annamaria Maciocia (
00:23:14
):
Yeah. That is, that is the high, you know, I think that's the highest achievement that an advisor can have
is knowing that your advisee is on their way to that type of growth. <affirmative> that type of
experience.
Jan Stivers (
00:23:35
):
Changes the person. Yes. Well, I have to get to more prosaic questions. <laugh> What was your work like
before you came to Marist?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:23:44
):
Okay. So I graduated from Albany Law School in 1990, and I had come home to very sad news that my
paternal grandmother was dying. She was diagnosed with a very aggressive cancer. And so I,
unfortunately, almost like graduation two weeks later were presented with like this, just this terrible
news. So I had to complete my work for the bar exam. So I was studying for the bar exam and I took the
bar exam. And then once I came home from the bar exam, essentially the next year of my life, I
functioned as her as her primary caregiver. Yes. She was.
Jan Stivers (
00:24:42
):
Now you had been living with her all through college?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:24:45
):
Absolutely. She was, you know, out with my maternal grandparents and then my paternal grandmother
was with us. And she you know, had just been obviously as all of my grandparents just always had been
there for me. And she just, her decline was just so, it was incredibly sad to witness. And then yet at the
same time, there was no desire to avoid or to withdraw from it, you know, you needed to simply be
there. <affirmative>. And so it was a year of Sloan Kettering. It was a year of, you know, trying
treatments that, you know, we would hope would give her some time. My father's two brothers who at
the time, both of them were alive, one since passed, but my two uncles were able to come to spend
some quality time with her. And so they came to the farm and had that opportunity. They stayed with us
too, and they had that opportunity to spend some time with her. And and that was just, you know, an
incredibly sad time <affirmative>. And so it was a time where I really did not want to do anything else.
Jan Stivers (
00:26:09
):
Right, and nor could you have and continued as a caregiver. Right.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:26:14
):
No. And it just presented itself that that was really where I needed to be at that time. And so then after
she passed away, it was January, 1992, she passed away. It was January eighth.
Jan Stivers (
00:26:36
):
Oh. So we coming on to the
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:26:38
):
Yeah, to the anniversary yeah. Three years. And so what happened after that was, I just systematically
changed my whole vision of where I thought I was going I thought, you know, I would reconnect with


some of my networking and intern experiences, which had been in law firms <affirmative> and to you
know, pursue some of those opportunities. And I just thought, I said, I just really wanna change what I
do. And I think I wanna be more in control of what I do. So I think I did probably the scariest thing
somebody could do between January 8th and March 1st. I started my own little in the home practice.
<affirmative>. I told my parents about this idea, and I just wanted to do this and just sort of put out my
shingle and see what would come independent practice. Yeah. And so my parents were very supportive
and it was awesome. I mean, so many people in my community, you know, obviously had a need for
different, you know, legal, different types of advice, representation, different things that would come
up. And it was a great, it was a great, you know, I still maintain that, that space and I still have that, I
don't do as much. I mean, in the early days, I just kind of took everything on, you know, so cuz you
wanted to do it. So you would really be very busy and at times, you know, it's very lonely because you're
the only person that you could really run ideas by. You really don't have somebody else to communicate
with. So it would just have that, I think that drawback, but I was, you know, very busy and one of my
clients was taking classes and she was, I think she was in a business law class and she was having
difficulty getting I think, some of the concepts down. So she would have questions occasionally that
were just academic <laugh> and she would say you know, by the way, I'm wondering if you could explain
this to me or, you know, whatever. And so I would just, you know, she's like, oh, you know, you really
have a great way of explaining things. And I said, oh, you know, thank you. I, you know, appreciate that.
And I sometime later I was just clearing up some newspapers and just, you know, trying to straighten
out a little bit, and I saw a Marist College ad looking for Paralegal, Adjunct instructors. Wow. And I said,
you know, I said, this sounds like this is like interesting. And you know, maybe I should, this is like the
class, that this Linda is taking. And I think this is, this sounds like a very interesting thing. So I remember
being asked to show up in Fishkill at the extension center <affirmative> and that's when I met Scott
Myers <affirmative> and Elizabeth Carr <affirmative> and to the world of weekend paralegal
<affirmative>. And before I met them, I was in the lobby and I could see these students sitting in a circle
and how passionate they were. And they were talking about the parts of the deed and they were just,
you know, going at it and quizzing each other. And I said, oh my goodness. I'm like, this is.
Jan Stivers (
00:30:36
):
Adult learners, they're on fire, aren't they?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:30:39
):
Yes. On fire. Exactly. They were great. And so I thought, oh no, I, this is fun. And so then it was some
time, I don't remember, maybe it was maybe months later that I got a call and I said, yes, of course. And
I'll come in. And that was that. And so I think,
Jan Stivers (
00:31:03
):
so you began as an adjunct?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:31:05
):
Oh, yes. In, I think 1993.
Jan Stivers (
00:31:09
):
Oh, very soon.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:31:09
):


Yeah, 1993 and I began as an adjunct and I would take a course here and there. And then at some point
Scott Meyers had mentioned to me that there was the opportunity to teach full time and that was going
to begin in 95. And was I interested and would I submit a resume? And that is when I. I said, oh yes. I
said, I'm interested in this opportunity. And I thought, I said, this is transitional, but the students had
such an interest in law in its pure sense to solve problems, to not to manipulate it so much, but to be in
awe of it. And I have to say that was incredibly attractive. Just that the rule of law, you know, it orders
our society that, you know, it is there to be respected and the students seem to have this keen
appreciation you.
Jan Stivers (
00:32:24
):
Yeah. I hope they're more attention now.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:32:27
):
More so than clients.
Jan Stivers (
00:32:29
):
Right.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:32:30
):
Because clients have a very focused <affirmative> need. <affirmative> and then you, you quickly see,
okay. People are sometimes limited in how they're willing to understand or appreciate, you know, things
people tend to want to go their way. And you can understand, and you can appreciate, their world and
how that shapes, you know, those desired outcomes. But teaching was the opportunity to back up from
all of that <affirmative> and to look at how things work <affirmative> with people who were interested
in how things work.
Jan Stivers (
00:33:15
):
<affirmative>. So you came on full time in 95?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:33:19
):
95/96 was my first Marc van der Heyden was the AVP and Dr. Vincent Tuscano was... I think we were,
was
Jan Stivers (
00:33:33
):
The department of
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:33:34
):
The Department, yes.
Jan Stivers (
00:33:35
):
Of Liberal arts here, department of Liberal Studies, was it called at that time?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:33:40
):
I think it, we were oh my goodness, you know, I don't remember that. Were we liberal the


Jan Stivers (
00:33:49
):
Humanities?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:33:50
):
Humanities...
Jan Stivers (
00:33:51
):
Was it humanities?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:33:52
):
I think we were. And Dr. Vincent Tuscano, and Scott Myers was the director of the paralegal program,
my boss.
Jan Stivers (
00:34:03
):
You eventually became director.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:34:05
):
This is correct when Scott retired. And if you asked me the year <laugh> I could become that. I just don't
recall. I don't recall.
Jan Stivers (
00:34:16
):
But you just moved into the director role when he retired.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:34:21
):
Well, I believe that, you know, there was a, I had discussions with with Dean Schaffer. <affirmative> so I
said, you know, I'm not sure.
Jan Stivers (
00:34:33
):
Marty was already Dean by that time?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:34:35
):
Yes. Martin Schaffer was already the Dean. And so I just, I told him that I was very interested in being
the program director that I had learned a great deal. And I believe Scott Meyers had also indicated that
there was, and so there was a year after he left, where we went from having a director who we teach
and then a faculty member who just one person in this department. And so I was carrying the director
responsibilities and I explained to the Dean that, you know, the only way I could see myself being the
director is if I could also, you know, teach, I do enjoy so much the teaching responsibilities.
<affirmative>. And so that's where,
Jan Stivers (
00:35:30
):
But there's, is there another person in the department today?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:35:33
):
No.


Jan Stivers (
00:35:35
):
So you're the director and the ins... I don't wanna say primary instructor, the instructor.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:35:42
):
Right.
Jan Stivers (
00:35:43
):
That's a lot
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:35:43
):
We have a wonderful adjunct faculty. At this time. So we have adjuncts who I am so blessed have been
with us for a long time. <affirmative> and two of them are actually our alums who participated in the
paralegal program. <affirmative> went on to law school who are my former students. <affirmative>
Practice law locally <affirmative> and come back to teach each a course. So that's great.
Jan Stivers (
00:36:12
):
That's great.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:36:12
):
And another one of our adjuncts is a student who essentially did the same, but under Scott Meyers. So
she was not my student, but she was his former student. So she had worked as a paralegal for 10 years
before she went to law school. She had full appreciation of. And then we have, you know, other
attorneys that are still, our faculty has like a very low attrition rate. I'm so pleased.
Jan Stivers (
00:36:46
):
The whole college.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:36:46
):
Yeah. Yeah. Thank God. And so we have two courses, there's the opportunity to teach in the weekend
and then also to teach in the evening, the same subject matter <affirmative> and I'm happy to say that's
what they do. So everybody has their course. And they're willing to teach it in the weekend. They're
willing to teach it in the evening so that everyone has that same experience, that same instructor. And I
mean, obviously that's the best of all worlds. That has been one of my goals since I became director.
Jan Stivers (
00:37:23
):
That was The question <laugh>. When you took over, what were your goals? What strategies did you
use to achieve them?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:37:29
):
Well, one of the, you know, I guess the goal is always maintaining ABA approval. Okay. So that has to be
your pragmatic goal. But then we, you know, we really wanna look at, okay, so how are we gonna
deliver the best possible education to our students? And faculty is at the heart of that. And so having a
law program where your faculty is engaged in family court during the day, and then they're coming at
night and they teach the family law course, and the weekend that person also <affirmative>, that means


that there's that commonality for the experience for the weekend students and the evening students.
It's always about equalizing <affirmative>. And that individual too is bringing, you know, from the real
world bringing. And that's why I also continue my practice experience. So, you know, I'm a sound justice
<affirmative>. And so I think it's so important for us to have that real world, gotta have some mud on
your boots <affirmative>, you know? That's important for our faculty. And so I then the teaching
experience, that is not always a given all lawyers think they can teach <laugh>
Jan Stivers (
00:39:00
):
Well, they speak to Juries.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:39:01
):
Yes. And they all believe, oh, no, no, no, this is gonna be, but sometimes it just doesn't work out. Yeah.
So with respect to the faculty, it has been very much about making sure that we support the adjuncts.
And hopefully those people who are having a good time doing this and want to do it, want to continue
are, you know, giving the students what they need. Right. So that's what you really love is when the
people who are doing it are also, you know, and so I'm pleased with that. The next thing about, you
know, the legal environment itself is that we are obviously constantly in the real world of change, you
know, we have the technology. So that is always something about manifesting the best curriculum,
making sure that we have the appropriate technology for our students. So right now we have taken this
launch into a Westlaw 24/7, all students who are in the paralegal program. So this is now our library
<affirmative> is Westlaw <affirmative>. So that is something that, you know, we hope is going to
continue to get people ready for what they need to do. So we had, you know, some Westlaw and some
books, but now we've launched Westlaw as the direction,
Jan Stivers (
00:40:40
):
The environment of the future really for lawyers.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:40:41
):
Yes, so now we we're on a system where all of our students are really being able to take that deep dive,
you know, into, Westlaw.
Jan Stivers (
00:40:54
):
What Other goals do you have for the program now that you've achieved some of these really significant
ones?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:41:00
):
Well, you know, and I guess the, the wonderful thing about being here, I think, is that Marist is so much
about giving students that education that prepares them for a lifetime, right. <affirmative> and I think
we need to be available to be accessible. So the American Bar Association in September had some
changes to the restrictions that were placed on programs for being, having an online presence.
Jan Stivers (
00:41:45
):
Okay. Right, right they have to.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:41:46
):


So that is really the next world that, you know, we are, we're going to be entering <affirmative>, but as
we do it, I really want that to be different from other <affirmative>, you know, institutions to that, do
that, how I think that, you know, our approach, of having that small group experience <affirmative>.
Jan Stivers (
00:42:14
):
Ready access to faculty.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:42:17
):
Yes. A faculty that are so dedicated. I think the weekend model will probably be a great way of launching
and doing a lot of synchronous <affirmative>. And so I think that is something I think that will be
distinctive. Yeah. COVID did that. We were the first academic program to have to pivot in March of
2020. So when we went on that break <affirmative> I feel so guilty because I was sitting in the Henry
Hudson Room <affirmative> I had so much work to do that week before break. And so I remember
saying to myself, oh, they just extended break by a week, I think I can catch up. Why did, God could you
please, this is what I need right now. And then all of a sudden,
Jan Stivers (
00:43:16
):
Two years later, <laugh>,
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:43:18
):
It's like this dooming globe. I said, I think I, you know, you gotta watch what you ask for, very careful
about this. So this is, yeah, so what, you know, you want to do is try to take some of that experience and
some of that challenge. So we had weekend classes that were coming up that weekend that could not
meet in face to face. So we were immediately, we were on WebEx <affirmative> we were, you know,
and I was telling my faculty was like, what, what is WebEx? What are you talking about? How are we
gonna, you know, and, but I think that, you know, too, in the courts, we've had to deal with Teams.
That's how we have all of our proceedings. And so, you know, we, we've just, we've had to embrace this.
And so I think here's an opportunity for us to take some of our one on one, some of our points of
distinction and to, you know, continue to allow them to, to move us <affirmative> in a direction where
we'll be available to students who could not otherwise take advantage of this program. <affirmative> So
that's obviously a goal. It's always a goal, is to try to grow the program in a way that we are there for
students so that students could benefit from this education.
Jan Stivers (
00:44:52
):
It sounds to me you're talking also about moving the program forward, growing the program in ways
that continue to reflect a Marist set of values, that the mission and values are still evident, say in the
availability of faculty, the willingness to make that pivot and do whatever you have to do to deliver a
good experience.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:45:15
):
Right. I mean I think absolutely, in terms of those Marist values are essential. When you look at you
know, the access to faculty and the kinds of experience, now also as a program, we are very good about
sprinkling in extras, you know, sort of always having a finger on the pulse of the local legal community.
What do you want to see in entry level paralegals? So when we identify the software, then we make
sure that our students have the opportunity to be introduced to that software. <affirmative> I make
sure that I run free notary prep classes. <affirmative> So that you are ready to take that notary test


<affirmative> I've developed a portfolio, model <affirmative> so that a student can develop a portfolio
with the thought that this portfolio is a bridge from your academic to your practical experience.
<affirmative>. And so, you know, in the years of having to work with students, I think being able to offer
them all of those extras as part of the program so that when they leave, they really are ready for their
first professional experience or they're ready if they go to law school, they have an excellent foundation.
Jan Stivers (
00:47:00
):
<affirmative> yeah. From what you've said, I get a really clear understanding of the importance of you
working as a town justice of your faculty. Well, I'll stay with you, you know, of having, you still practice,
right?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:47:20
):
Yes, yes. Still take odd matters. Yeah, absolutely.
Jan Stivers (
00:47:23
):
So it makes perfect sense to me. How do you do it, while also being a fulltime faculty member?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:47:33
):
Well, I'm a professional lecturer, which is truly, I think, a godsend to me because that enables me to use
that professional experience as my professional development. Okay. So that opportunity to take on
projects, to take on work in my practice,
Jan Stivers (
00:48:02
):
Rather than writing an article or presenting at a conference
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:48:06
):
Exactly. That enables me to be able to provide the oversight to my program. And then within the areas
that I teach, I teach three areas, Intro to Law, Legal Research and Writing, <affirmative> Real Property
Title <affirmative>. And so in those areas, you know, being a transactional lawyer, helps me to develop,
you know, that course. Yeah. And to shape what students need to learn in that. So
Jan Stivers (
00:48:39
):
So the complementary, yeah. Yes. That makes sense to me.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:48:42
):
And as a judge, you know, I think that the areas that, where I have to write and I have to research and
my opinions, you know, so I, <affirmative> do end up spending a significant amount of time resolving
cases on paper rather than issuing.
Jan Stivers (
00:49:02
):
Yeah, yeah. You think about that.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:49:04
):


Yeah. Rather than issuing a verbal opinion. <affirmative> I often, you know, do write. You know, my
rationale and my opinion for the individuals. Now being a town justice, the people who normally read
these opinions are my court clerk <laugh> and the people who receive them. And I have to say, I've been
blessed with many court clerks who have just had a very generous spirit and they read the opinions. And
they're very good about. I remember I had an engagement ring case, this was a few years ago just
before COVID. And so I had to go back and do a significant amount of, you know, research on the statute
cases and application. And it was a case that, you know, had a great deal of emotional <affirmative>
build up. And so the staff in the courthouse, I think they were all waiting for, you know, this decision,
you know, to come out, they wanted to read it. And the clerks were just you know, just shaking their
heads one day. And I walk in and I said, no, what happened? I said, you know, how did that go? At the
end of my case, I offered the opportunity to return the ring in lieu of, you know, paying the money to
the other party and she said, oh, you know, she said, you laid out everything so nicely. It was an eight
page opinion. <laugh> Some of them were like 16. And she said, you laid out everything so nicely. She
said, they just turned to the end <laugh> they just turned the pages to the end. She said, I don't even
wanna tell you, they just turned to the end to read the, the end of it.
Jan Stivers (
00:51:02
):
It's good. Cause it's like we're giving students lots of feedback on papers and they just checked the
grade.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:51:08
):
What's the grade... And so I said, you know, I said, that's all they needed. I said, I think the rest of it was
just for me. I just needed to know, i was deciding it correctly. And the clerk i mean to appreciate, she
said you really just can't make a decision like that off the cuff. You really have to work through it. Yeah.
She said you had to. And so when you can see it again through somebody who is just being very neutral
and just, you know, approaching it in that way, not having a state, you know, just looking at it, you can
say, okay. You know, somebody else gets it. And that's important. That's important.
Jan Stivers (
00:51:51
):
There's really a link to the last question I wanna ask in this section, this part. And that is about you
having received the highest honor, the college awards for Excellence in Teaching the Board of Trustees
Award for Excellence in Teaching. And I wanna ask about the impact that had on you.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:52:15
):
Well, I think after that award, I said, I have to get busy. I really have to earn this. I have to somehow you
know, live up to this. I think, you know, I can't imagine, and still, you know, being selected for that. And I
think that there are times where maybe we're challenged in different ways. And so in many ways I see
that award as being a challenge. <affirmative>, I mean, I've gotta get busy, I've gotta do this. Marist has
been just an incredible place. It has been a gift to me in my life. It really has.It has brought into my life so
many exceptional individuals.
Jan Stivers (
00:53:14
):
Can you? Let's talk about them.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:53:16
):
Whether they were faculty,


Jan Stivers (
00:53:21
):
Can you identify some of them?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:53:22
):
Well, of course I, you know, there, just in terms of Scott Myers, <affirmative> the, from the paralegal
program, he was just an incredibly generous individual in giving me this opportunity. Any of those
resumes would have worked. I know, and it was just an incredibly generous opportunity for me to try
something different. And it was something that, and he was also a type of individual who would just
allow you to grow and, you know, learn from your own mistakes. He was a, just an incredible person to
work for and to work with. He was not micromanager. He was not, not any of those things, just really
very generous in his assessment of my abilities. And so I always found it a great pleasure and honor, to
work for him.
Jan Stivers (
00:54:38
):
Anybody else?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:54:39
):
Well, yes. I mean, I had Lou Zuccarello.
Jan Stivers (
00:54:42
):
What a gem. Oh, I'm sure Scott too. I just didn't know Scott very well, but I know Lou very well.
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:54:50
):
Lou Zuccarello was just an incredible mentor, in terms of, you know, from my arrival here, was someone
who, I just felt that, you know, if I had a question I could just go in and it was, and Bill Olson. Yeah, and
Tom Casey. And so there, I think were just individuals who were, you know, so established, so didn't
need to reach out, didn't need to, you know, but they were just incredible. They were, I think I was
blessed with the series of great deans, Vincent Tuscano and Regina Habucha . Oh, so Janetta was just,
she was just incredible to work for as well. And she is the one who asked me to be the pre-law advisor
<affirmative> and that was, that just opened up a whole new world of a different way of working with
students that I enjoy profoundly. And so just giving me, having the confidence that I would be able to
add, you know, contribute to them that way. I thought that was just incredible. In addition to her, then
Thom Wermuth <affirmative> and I have as a Dean and as a Vice President, I always have found him to
be an individual who is supportive and constructive and helpful. Just you know, again, a person who
shaped my experience here in a very positive way. And my current Dean, Marty Schaffer, <affirmative>
who I cannot, these are people we are just in observing them and their capacity to resolve conflict.
<affirmative> their capacity to engage with various problems, their personalities, you know, I just think
an individual would be lucky to run into one of these people. Wow. And I've run into all of them. Yeah.
You know, I've had to all of them as overseers, I think that has to say something about the Marist culture
that these individuals choose to come here and that they stay and that they contribute.
Jan Stivers (
00:58:05
):
So, can you talk about what you perceive to be the Marist culture? And I don't wanna lead you in this
direction, but I do want to ask if you perceive the influence of the Marist Brothers still in the college.


Annamaria Maciocia (
00:58:20
):
Well, being Catholic, I think that also shapes, you know, the way I'm gonna perceive things,
<affirmative> so yes, I'm gonna perceive it from being part of that. But I think it's possible for you to
come from different experiences and still to, to see that and to find that, and I think that's what the
Marist Brothers would have intended and would've wanted as well, that this would be a universal
experience that people who come here would have that. It wouldn't just come from somebody having,
let's say a Catholic worldview <affirmative> but really from a any multitude of perspectives that, you
know, this is a college like no other,
Jan Stivers (
00:59:09
):
In what way?
Annamaria Maciocia (
00:59:12
):
In the way that the level of commitment I think I see in the faculty, the level of just the, in terms of the
commitment that, you know, the faculty have to the development of students right now, the
commitment at Vassar I wanna go back to okay. Was a commitment to one's discipline <affirmative>
and that is a noble thing. <affirmative> But here, I think people are committed to both their discipline
and to their students.<affirmative> I think it's teaching, teaching, teaching <affirmative>. And I think that
when that is the central focus, I think that that ultimately allows you to, you know, manifest that
discipline to your students in a way that really will hopefully shape and enlarge their worldview.
<affirmative> You know, so, I do for me, and there are other individuals that I wanna mention. Yeah.
And Joanne Meyers <affirmative>, I mean, she has always just been an incredibly, just a very wonderful
colleague, just you know, very open, very if I needed somebody to debate or discuss an issue <laugh> I
did not happen two seconds. You know? And I mean, we could be in total disagreement here and you
know, talking about tomato soup or, you know, our favorite dessert or whatever here, and we both
loved tiramisu. Right? <Affirmative> so we could, you know, and we don't, and that would be in the
same paragraph, you know, <affirmative> people don't, and I, so I feel that there is this focus on
teaching. There's just this generosity in how we accept others. I, to me, that has been a big part of my
experience here.
Jan Stivers (
01:01:52
):
Yeah. That's beautiful.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:01:54
):
It has you know, incredible. Rose DeAngelis who came in with you <affirmative> who did.
Jan Stivers (
01:02:00
):
She's the same time?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:02:01
):
Rose? Yes. Rose came in with me. She was one of my contemporaries and you know, there are just
numerous people. I could go through that whole building in Fontaine, <affirmative> Irma Casey, you
know, yeah.
Jan Stivers (
01:02:16
):


Well, these are your colleagues who shaped your experience. Can you talk for a little bit about how you
see kind of the leaders who shaped the college, and I shouldn't say the leaders, but people who are
responsible for the success that Marist is today and how it's changed in the 20 years you've been,
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:02:41
):
And that's probably the one person who I, Dr. Murray. I mean, I am just in awe of Dr. Murray and
everything that he has been to Marist College. First of all, he had, in coming back to the college and
helping us navigate the entire COVID nightmare when it would have been perfectly okay and
understandable for somebody to say I'm retired. Right. That shows a level of commitment that goes
beyond just being a college president who is committed to a college and who is committed to his legacy.
It's commitment to the legacy of the college. That is why he is a phenomenal leader because he, his
commitment is just to everything Marist is. And so I find that our history and having had him for so many
years, I think it just, it manifests, you know, an individual who has really made the college part of, you
know, part of who he is. I mean, I think he's just always been so committed. The college has, you could
see the college has just been more than just a workplace to him. <affirmative> and I think that's,
Jan Stivers (
01:04:35
):
For sure. For sure. Anyone else you think has shaped the college?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:04:42
):
I think we have so many people, you know, I think if you look at HRVI just in terms of where we're
located, <affirmative> Thom Wermuth, you've got that the idea about that focus on a national treasure,
that is our backyard, that is our campus. Yeah. So I think that Thom in that way has just, you know, really
given you know, this college a point of national distinction and you know, this is something that has, you
know, percolated it from an idea to a room, to an Institute, to a journal, to internships, these amazing
speakers. So, you know, I think you have that too. I think it's not, it's the, and I think his leadership there
is the ability to, you know, see something that all of us look at <laugh> every day
Jan Stivers (
01:05:45
):
And recognize its value
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:05:48
):
And recognize its value. And recognize how we can somehow present this to the world, how we project
this to the world. So I think that, you know, for that reason right there. And then I really think that when
you look at our collective on campus, you know, who has shaped us the most, the different students
who come here. The students who select from all of the many places where they can go and they
decide, okay, I'm gonna pull the trigger. I'm going to Marist College. This is, I voted, I've made my
decision. I'm going here. And they come here and I love that, you know, the fall semester and you look
around and this place, and it's increasingly becoming more diverse <affirmative>. And I believe that that
too is another way that we take, you know, this beautiful place with the devoted faculty that are so
committed to their students. And this is another way that we project it outwards, because then it goes
home. It goes to not just Westchester, but to the Bronx. It goes to different places, different
communities. And it becomes part of their, you know, that's how Vassar became a household name in
my household. <affirmative> And Marist, you know, becomes in a community where maybe they are not
identifying with Christianity or in, but we, or with college at all, but it is now it it's a seed that's gonna be


planted out there. <affirmative>. And so I think that the more and more we can bring in a diverse
population of students, I think that is an outstanding way.
Jan Stivers (
01:08:03
):
In addition to the increased diversity of the students, what are the changes, do you notice in the student
body over your time here?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:08:12
):
Well, I, I have to say that we have gone from when I first came, students who were first time, college
<affirmative> right. To, I think there was a point in time where we, the students were very savvy about
college. Their parents were college educated <affirmative>. So I saw this transition <affirmative> from
students who maybe were working a full time job. I, one of my adjuncts love to tell the story. She was
emancipated when she was 16, working 40 hours as a waitress, a full-time student here and doing her
traditional college experience. She managed this tuition. She was one of the, in my early years, so we
had these, you know, students who were working hard, you know, sort of this maybe college, you know,
not even in the picture in their family. And then we went, I think, to a time where, you know, we were
getting the children of teachers <affirmative> right. The children of teachers. The children. So we had
students who were savvy. And now I think to a certain extent were going back again to where, for many
of our students, because of the increased diversity, we're seeing that first time college again.
<Affirmative> So I think there's a cycle that's interesting <affirmative> I do think that our, so those are
some of their background, experience in terms of their families. I think that students are because of,
unfortunately I think COVID right now limits the ways that we can appreciate our students. Right.
Everybody's in class masked, probably speaking as little as they possibly can, <affirmative> and trying to,
everyone's kind of carrying their own burdens of how this experience has touched them personally,
their community. So, it's probably harder to look at them over the past two years. <affirmative>, you
know. I think that they're suffering from sort of this, well they're suffering from the outpouring of the
pandemic. I know that before the pandemic, I always used to give my students a little speech when at
the end of the semester where I would say, Hey, go home. And don't be with your peers for a little
while, learn intergenerationally, spend some time with the different generations in your own family and,
you know, learn something there. And so now who do they wanna talk to, to do that, right?
Jan Stivers (
01:11:21
):
Yeah. So right. This is a silver lining here. Yes.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:11:26
):
One would hope, right. So what are we gonna see as a result? How is this gonna manifest itself?
<affirmative> So that now they've had this opportunity for this, you know, intergenerational experience
more so where I think people were spending a lot of time just with peers. <affirmative> And so that
influences you. So now you have a different sort of a different way of looking at the world and then we'll
have to see how that manifests itself.
Jan Stivers (
01:12:01
):
Right. I may be able to infer this from what you've already said, but what advice would you have for
people who are considering a faculty position at Marist and for people who are currently faculty
members?


Annamaria Maciocia (
01:12:21
):
Well, based on, you know, on my experience here, I would say somebody who is considering it, I would
say, do it. This is going to be the opportunity of a lifetime. The college is really, it's an open canvas. You
have that opportunity, you know, to really come and to bring your passion for your discipline. You have
students who are pliable. I think that's one consistent feature of our students. <affirmative> I have
found that, you know, my students are willing to listen.
Jan Stivers (
01:13:15
):
They are, I agree.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:13:16
):
Sometimes, you know, it's almost like you think, okay, they're willing to listen too much. I've gotta get
them talking more. <affirmative> but they are definitely, they are willing to listen. They're a blank slate
they're willing to learn for me. <affirmative> right. So that I think for anybody who has a desire to teach
that this is the place where you wanna be <affirmative> because you have students, you have colleagues
who are going to, who are gonna be supportive <affirmative> and a place where you can thrive. I really
do see this and...
Jan Stivers (
01:14:06
):
Do you see changes or adjustments that you think current faculty should make?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:14:11
):
Oh, I think that our new president is, I think the perfect person for this time. I feel that he brings an
energy to this campus, that he is the right person for this time. And I am excited to return herein the
spring. I'm, you know, it's, it's everything. I just believe that the, everything that has come from the
president's office has manifested you know, a strong desire to cultivate a campus that appreciates that
invites, you know, diverse diversity in thought, you know, diversity in creativity. So I'm very excited
about what <affirmative> the future holds here. And I think that any new faculty member should just be
inspired. I mean, how could you not <affirmative>, you know, and I find that there is a generous,
welcoming coming from the president's office and that, you know, that is an incredible strength to this
college because we just want to be able to be accessible to all students. <affirmative>, We don't want
any barriers <affirmative> and I just believe that, you know, that's the energy I say, that's coming, you
know, from there. So I think I see that as a, just a tremendous strength. And I think that new faculty
should be inspired by that.
Jan Stivers (
01:16:23
):
Are you able to look down the road 10 or 15 or 20 years and predict what Marist might look like then if
you had a crystal ball, what would you see?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:16:49
):
I think that 10, 15 years down the road that, you know, Marist has that potential of continuing to be a
vibrant community. I think having a strong sense of community, I think that's <affirmative>, that is.
Jan Stivers (
01:17:22
):
Our mission, right?


Annamaria Maciocia (
01:17:22
):
Yeah. I do believe that we are still going to you know, draw and you know, hopefully attract, students to
come to this place to learn, because this is a safe place for them to the, during that transitional time.
<affirmative> That they're going to be greeted by a culture of support and that, you know, that this will
still be, you know, that the nexus of this place <affirmative>, I don't think when, you know, it's funny
because I think of some institutions and I could think of some great things or a lab or something like that
that matters. But when I think of Marist, I think of community.
Jan Stivers (
01:18:25
):
I do too.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:18:27
):
I really think that this is a place where, you know, people come toto learn, this is a place that's safe. This
is a place that is structured
Jan Stivers (
01:18:39
):
Accepting.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:18:40
):
Yeah, yeah,
Jan Stivers (
01:18:41
):
This has been wonderful. Tell me, aren't there things that you were thinking you'd want to say that I
didn't ask about?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:18:55
):
You know, I can't, I truthfully, I didn't think too much. <laugh> which is probably none of us did
Jan Stivers (
01:19:03
):
No, no, no... So many things that I didn't ask you we covered you know, they came about indirectly.
Well, here's one, I didn't get to, it's out of place now, but your program has a strong career orientation
and you're housed in the school of Liberal Arts, which compared to other schools does not have so much
of a focus on career preparation. Opportunities or challenges that that's presented to you?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:19:44
):
Only opportunities because we are like the little sister <laugh> of the School of Liberal Arts, right.
<affirmative>, Political Science always says we're their little sisters sometimes. So, and there's this
wonderful dialogue that takes place <affirmative>. So right within my building, I mean, law is influenced
by History, by Philosophy, by Politics. <affirmative> There's this need to be able to speak to people in
their language <affirmative>. So our students really have to immerse themselves in everything that's
going on in the school of Liberal Arts. You know, so it's really, it has just been...
Jan Stivers (
01:20:33
):
That's great sense. Yeah.


Annamaria Maciocia (
01:20:34
):
And, and so, in a way we really just have this label of obviously where this pre-professional where this
way that you can go, but how do you build that foundation will look all around the school of Liberal Arts
and you have where that, you know, that foundation has to come. Our certificate for the students who
come for the certificate only is 60 credits. <affirmative> 36 of those credits are, you know, general
education, 18 credits have to be in the Liberal Arts and then 24 are in law. So that right there tells you
how important the rest of the houses are.
Jan Stivers (
01:21:21
):
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:21:24
):
Yeah. We're just part of that. And I just find that so many times, listening to my colleagues, who I see is
just caring about the institution and caring about their discipline and wanting to you know, influence
different things and bringing them up different. I just I find that, you know, much of that is very
important. It's very good for me to be reflective and appreciative <affirmative> and understanding of
what's going on in these disciplines.
Jan Stivers (
01:21:58
):
affirmative> I don't think I asked you directly about what you would consider your greatest achievement
at Marist.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:22:07
):
It hasn't happened yet.
Jan Stivers (
01:22:09
):
<laugh> Wow. <laugh>.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:22:13
):
I've gotta come up with this.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:22:14
):
You're really aiming high.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:22:17
):
No I've gotta come up with some good stuff.
Jan Stivers (
01:22:18
):
How about your greatest challenge?
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:22:25
):
I have to say, I think that, you know, the greatest challenge always comes on the first day of every
semester when you're staring down that group of people who are looking at you, like, how is she gonna
be, how is this gonna go <affirmative> and it's always those first few minutes of class getting everybody


to settle in <affirmative> I think that, you know, you have sort of repetitive challenges that come up with
here and there, but that's always the most, that's the one that I like to reflect on the most. <Affirmative>
I think you have to create you know, a sense of ease and calm and just hopefully to invite those that
you're either teaching or working with to, you know, want to, to work with you on whatever that
journey is. <affirmative> and I think that's at any given task, that's always the greatest challenge is
always to try to kind of bring people on board. Making sure that you are up to that task of you know,
putting out of yourself
Jan Stivers (
01:23:54
):
To share the vision. How about disappointments? Any disappointments,
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:24:00
):
Marist, I have to say that this has just, this has been a blessing to my life.
Jan Stivers (
01:24:08
):
<affirmative> I would say the same for myself.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:24:10
):
It has, it has been a blessing to be here. <affirmative> um, I have no disappointment, no
disappointment. This has just been an incredible blessing. I have been privileged to be here.
Jan Stivers (
01:24:36
):
Yeah. And of course we're having this because it's so clear to so many that you have shaped it, you have
contributed to Marist being what it is, you know, it's good for you. That's wonderful. You've also made it
the place that's been good for the rest of us.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:24:57
):
Oh, well, I that's been, you know, again, thank you. I appreciate, you know, having the opportunity to
discuss some of these, you know, thoughts and I can only you know, I can only say I'm just grateful for
the opportunity to be here really.
Jan Stivers (
01:25:17
):
Me too, me too. Thank you very, very much.
Annamaria Maciocia (
01:25:20
):
Appreciate it.